HD in Genetics - Page 2

clc29,
Are you going to breed this dog? or is this simply going to be a working SAR partner?
the reason I ask is most SAR people I know, never breed their dogs.  not saying none do, but most in my area don't.  if you are looking to breed, then by all means go about this looking at the genetic standpoint, but if you just want a working dog, find one already tested and screen clear of HD.  if you want to breed, spend alot of time studying pedigree's and better yet, locate a breeder who has been successful in producing what you want and see if they may mentor you.  you can easily look at websites and find the top producing males for normal hips,  but even the best dogs in the world still can produce a health problem.  I just want you to understand that. no line and no dog is immune.

You've mentioned that three times now, but prelims are no guarantee.  Can't guarantee you'll get two eyes, two ears, a tongue and a tail for that matter.  Spend years training and raising a dog with all the clearances, and you still might be wasting your time and money in SAR......... well, because it's SAR.  Remember though, it's an expense writeoff come tax time.

Darylehret,
You have always answered my posts kindly and with great thought.  Which is why I can't figure out why would you say "......,and you still might be wasting your time and money in SAR.....well, because it's SAR? What did you mean by that?

Being a SAR person is voluntary and not about money or time. It's about helping people. We do not get paid for getting called out at all hours to hike all night and into the day, in rain and/or snow, or blistering heat, to look for someones loved one who has not returned home. We do not get reimbursed for the hours spent training our dogs or the vet bills to keep them healthy and in peak condition.

Unfortunately, if it were about the money I am sure that a lot more people would be interested in participating. 

While I appreciate the advice you have given. I do not appreciate the snarky comment about SAR.

Uber Land,
At this point I am not sure about breeding yet. I want to have done enough research that should I decide to breed at a later date I can do so responsibly. 

As someone from this forum once replied to me, " picking out a dog can be a crap shoot, but the best way to tip the odds in your favor are to do plenty of due diligence", which is what I am trying to do.

When I posted this question I was also hoping that someone might suggest a few dogs to look at so that I may learn from their pedigrees. SOOO, any suggestions?


C

I've had SAR dogs, quite good ones too, but the pedigree's were mixed at best (workingline Mink grson to an old american "pet bred" bitch).  lucky for me, the "pet bred" bitch had insane, nonstop ball and search drive and a strong genetic willingness to please and she passed it on to her pups. her son who was certified sired 1 litter with a WG showline girl (Ulk grdaughter from vom haus Miller kennel) and 1/2 that litter is now at certifying age, and from what I hear, they are just like their daddy. 

I can recommend breeders who have consistently produced nice dogs with good health more than I can recommend a certain line.  I know there are a few DDR breeders in this country who certify and breed mainly for SAR.  I feel it is one of the most important services outside police work that these dogs fulfill.  I think when I am better health wise, I want to certify one of my pups thru SAR instead of Schutzhund.  maybe it can help someone that way.

 the hips producers though are known to be Mink (have a linebred Mink girl, but watch those, they can be screamers, literally), Yoschy (found some Yoschy dogs to be animal aggressive), Norbo Ben Ju, and I am sure others can add to the list.

personally, I would go with the WG/Bel workinglines, I feel you get more consistency with the drives and energy needed for SAR work. some czech dogs can be a little too serious, not all but some, and DDR dogs mature very slow, again not all but alot do.
I personally like the Mink/Yoschy cross but those are getting back several gen. on pedigree's now adays, and I am not on the up and up with some of the newer dogs. check out Dornburg kennel, I have seen her dogs work, and have always loved them.  she tends to have older lines, and I know her to be very honest and reputable.

also another breeder who knows alot about her lines and the health behind them is Dragon gsd.

My "remark" was sarcastically fitting to UberLand's dim outlook.  As if, no matter what you do, everything in the universe is random, and there is no escaping it's misfortunes.  I was joining in her negativity, since she was being argumentative, as if any of her statements could withstand the same approach to debate.  I know full well what you'll be facing in your persuit, and nothing I said was "untrue" about it; you will waste lots of time and money.  SOOO, no more suggestions from me.  Good luck.

clc29,
  do your homework, hips aren't all the dog has, have they certified eyes, elbows, thyroid, heart, temperament, and checked for DM on their breeding stock?

Do their dogs have a history of bloat, epilepsy, allergies, pancreatic enzyme deficency, heart mumurs, any monorchidism or cryptorchidism, although, sometimes those are things only disclosed breeder to breeder.

  You'll also want to know what the average life span is in the blood lines they are using, I like to see a GSD live into his teens.

  Good luck with your search!
            Paula

There is no line of German Shepherd that I know exists that will not throw dysplastic pups. There are some dogs and lines that are stronger than others in the hip area. So you can stack the deck, but if you stack it too much other things start becoming entrenched. You would have to have a controlled environment in which you kept all the dogs and x-rayed them like the Bio-sensor program of the Army in the 60/70s. They got the hip results up to above 90% good hips in the progeny...but it came with a price.

there was a poster here from Sweden a while back, who seemed to have quite a bit of experience in SAR.

Also breeding dogs for SAR. Can't remember the user name (maybe Heidi), but if you can dig it out, probably a good source of info.

Rik

the poor individual who was asking a simple question and got some half wit answers.   

YES  HD is a genetic condition in the breed.  Guess what,  HD is produced through genetics, nutrition and just bad environmental upbringing.

Please feel free to contact me privately and I will give you a minor grocery list to examine.   It isn't rocket science but it does take some time 

And those half wit answers please, please stop it.  I get your client's questions about why this and that all the time.   What can I say? 

My MS is in Animal Nutrition and specifically bone growth.  I have significant data on the GSD.   I am happy to help. 


Nancy Rhynard
www.westwoodkennels.com