protection work!!! SHATTERED! - Page 2

Join a schutzhund club?  No, the person said they want real life stuff.  What if the person wants real protection? 

How about follow your trainers advice and do whats right for the dog not just what you want to do.  The military sucks at training dogs by the way.  That aside, stop trying to complain about wanting to rush things.  If you needed protection so bad, go get a gun.  Or you should have bought an older dog if you were so impatient.

Leigh, please post a video of this perfect obedience your 1 year old dog has.  Would be good to see.  Never heard of finished ob on a 1 year old, you know it takes longer than that.  You want a dog dangerous when it doesnt listen?


Mobjack, you start a dog in prey and they will always view protection that way, thats not how you start a personal protection or police dogs thats how you start sport dogs, best to wait until dog is mature and has off leash ob before agitating

Your trainer is 100% rite and you should listen ppd training is totally different than schutzhund or any other sport training.  I know its hard to wait when you are eager to go been there myself it sucks.  But it is the best thing for the dog last thing you want to do is mess your dog up.  Rite now the best thing to do is work on your ob it can you can always sharpen it up on and off leash.  Just be patient and continue to bond with your dog that is a big part of real pp work i promise.  The dog has to believe his pack will protect him then he wont have a second thought about protecting his pack.

Feather?????
Feather says...follow your dog trainers advice( the trainer has military training background), then Feather says; the military sucks at training anyway.... I wonder what kind of dogs in the military did you train Feather??? Or do you have an uninformed opinion?
BTW, I said join a Sch club because your trainer told you your dog wasn't ready....he wasn't mature enough as assessed by the trainer, you seem to want to continue inspite of this advice. My advice was saying if you still want to do bitework and NOT follow the advice of the trainer than a place like a Sch club would allow that without damaging the dog. You didn't say anything in your original post about wanting a PPD and so I didn't assume that.
My best advice is to stick with the regiment your trainer is setting up. Everything you said he said sounds like sound advice based on what he sees. JMO

 Military ?? Oh lord .. are you in the military ?? then IMO you DO NOT need a military canine !! do YOU know what he make up of a military canine  entails ?? believe me ... THAT is not what you want in the average   every day life !! OR .. do you ?? there are other endeavors , sport :  french or belgium ring. campagna , mondio , psa , nvbk , knvp,  sch etc. or pers. protect. -- at that .. even in those cases .. i start a pup with the potential at 6..  8 or 10 weeks even .. WHY ... because i can aid in developing the canine emotionally , psychologically , physically .. teaching the dog  .. such things as basic skills ,  communication , manners , trust , security / well being  , esteem , confidence [ etc. ad nauseum ] and most important self control !! can't give a seminar here .. BUT when i hear someone state wait until the dog is older .. Generally .. again generally .. that tells me ...[ IMO without offense ] that person not only doesn't know or understand canines .. but also  canine capabilities .. /  one had better know dam well the canine mind / behavior and know dam well what they are doing !! even more so .. they better understand people too ... how many average every day folk .. can even handle a military dog.. 

ALPHAPUP, well said.

OP

I start my pups at a very young age. With that said though all there work is done in prey and just imprinting to build confidence in the work and show them similar things to what they will encounter down the road. Each dog is different in the rate it matures, %'s of drives its shows, hardness, mentality, etc....So therefore every dog is worked differently at different ages. You cant rush or push to hard on a young dog or you will most definitely ruin them.

Many different trainers and helpers have different opinions on how training should be conducted and I am not going to get to deep into that on here. However some trainers believe it is better to wait for the dogs to show some maturity because they start working there dogs defensively in the beginning. just to keep it simple.

personally ive seen dogs pulled from the field til they mature somewhat and come back monsters. ive seen dogs that can withstand a lot of pressure at abnormally young ages and thrived. Every dog is different. Personally i would trust your trainer as he knows what fits into his system. by going to multiple trainers it will confuse you and your dog. if you make a change then stick with it and follow there lead. however your trainer if he is worth his salt knows what your dogs capabilities are and how he fits into his program and if he doesn't think the dog has what it takes then he should say so. But as you mentioned he says he thinks your dog does. So follow his lead and instructions.

you cant put a deadline on progression and development. you will only let yourself and your dog down! be patient enjoy the ride and you will be much more satisfied with the results.

I do have a question though-  did your trainer tell you to do anything in the mean time while your waiting for his maturity to rise?

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HAHA Gustav, the feather strikes again.

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Alphapup,

i agree totally on development obviously. However i wouldn't say just because you take a break and wait on the dog to give a little more doesn't mean someone doesn't understand dogs. I can see where your coming from but i wouldn't say its always the case.

Feather,

You wrote:

Mobjack, you start a dog in prey and they will always view protection that way, thats not how you start a personal protection or police dogs thats how you start sport dogs, best to wait until dog is mature and has off leash ob before agitating

I must say I really disagree with this and have not found this to be the case, IME.  We work our Police dogs in prey all the time.  Prey brings speed for sport dogs and Police K9's.  Even on a courage test in sport or a fleeing felon, fast movements by the decoy or bad guy should be viewed as prey.  Prey brings speed, speed brings force.  Force = mass x speed.  The faster a dog hits a decoy or a bad guy the more force that is generated.  This is better for both sport dogs and Police dogs.  After the hit, if there is a fight the dog can easily switch to defense and fight. 

I also like to wait on heavy OB until the dog is set in his bite work. 

JMO FWIW,

Jim