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by missbeeb on 11 December 2009 - 10:12
Jemima, I asked you on this very forum for assitance with tackling the KC re: mandatory health checks... you refused.
You had the perfect platform for helping EVERY breed in the UK and you produced a Soap Opera, imo.
You say:
I have, as you know, been very consistent re the need for conformation changes in the breed (about which obviously we disagree), but I have also been consistently supportive of the Breed Council's demand for tougher health testing. From my recent DogsToday column:
What do you actually know about the correct conformation of ANY breed? Why would we listen to a complete novice Jemima, especially one that selects the worst possible photographs and resorts to selective editing to make a "case" or in this instance, a Soap Opera. Your main (only?) objective is clearly the making of money, please don't do it at the expense of us and our dogs.
You said that someone on this forum had threatened to shoot you; as you know, that was me... tongue in cheek, but you couldn't even convey that simple truth... there's no cure for your like... imo!
by jaymesie51 on 11 December 2009 - 11:12
Ah Jemima rearing your head again i see, first thing first you know F A about the german shepherd you seen a way to make some cash and went for it what you said about the hind movement of the german shepherd was nothing but scare mongering i dont get to every GSD show but do get to most and i can assure you 98% of the dogs i see are not cow hocked yes you do see 1 or 2 now and again it is a fault like any other and will be addressed by breeders but nowhere near as bad as you tried to paint the picture your words above (We call them health tests, but they’re not really anything of the sort – they’re just tests for hideous inherited diseases.) We humans have hideous inherited diseases and we try to make sure all is done to prevent them THAT IS WHAT HEALTH TESTING IS that is why we hip/elbow score haemophilia test we are trying to prevent the spread of these hideous diseases A breed survey is done for dogs/bitches that have passed all current health tests so again to try and prevent these hideous diseases Now our Breed Standard our breed is German not British who do you and the KC think you are to say that a breed that is one of the largest breeds in the world is breeding to the wrong standard one that is internationally recognised and approved by the SV that is the standard we should all breed to not the one you and your cronies want the Alsation one ( how many of the breeders of the Alsation type have there stock breed surveyed) As i said to you on a previous post you are nothing more than a money graber only interested in how much money you can make certainly not interested in the health or welfare of the German Shepherd Dog and as such you should concentrate your knowledge on where it belongs IN THE GUTTER.
jim h
by Jemima Harrison on 11 December 2009 - 11:12
Please furnish the proof of this.
I have consistently pushed for mandatory health testing as a condition of KC registration. In my view it's the only way the KC register can recover some integrity and for a pedigree certificate to actually mean someting. The current ABS is a joke.
Having said all that, apart from writing about it and highlighting it in media interviews (which I already do), I am not sure what else you would like me to do. It's not exactly as if the Kennel Club hangs on my every word (unless it's to mutter under their breath about how much they hate my continued interference and who the hell am I anyway) (Something you no doubt have in common!).
I'd be happy to hear your suggestions (genuinely) if you think I can do more. Although remember that I also feel strongly about the need for conformational changes (and also support the KC re double-handling although don't feel so strongly about this as I just think it's a bit silly rather than damaging) so I'm not sure how much you really want me onside.
But again, re health testing, I'm with you all the way.
Jemima
by Trotters123 on 11 December 2009 - 12:12
Firstly I have to say How do we know that this person writing on this board IS actually THE Jemima Harrison? It could be her or it could quite possibly be someone purporting to be her!!!!
I personally think that the real Jemima Harrison would not even dare come on to this site unless to use the comments made here in one of her 'programmes' and again to edit and falsely portray the GSD.
My advise is be wary of what is said, just in case it is the REAL Jemima Harrison but keep in mind that it may be someone in disguise!!!
Secondly. I do not attend very many shows now but I do have to say that I do disagree strongly with Jaymsie51 in as much as the numbers he is stating with regards to 'cow hocks'.
The percentages speak for themselves, I only attend approx 3/4 breed shows in a year now and I can tell you for a fact that about 50% of the dogs being exhibited have to certain degrees 'cow hocks'! So this then taken with the amount of dogs shown over the period of the year would far excede Jaymsie51's statement of only 1 or 2 dogs suffering from it.
Some of the dogs shown can be given a ball of wool at the start of the gaiting and have a fine sweater knitted for you by the time it comes back! THIS to me is a problem which some people are choosing NOT to see.
Is it the case that too much emphasis is being placed on side movement and not the same on coming and going. I have seen dogs being held back that much that their fronts don't even touch the ground, hence there is then pressure on their rears to push forward even more, giving the Judge NO chance of inspecting the true movement.
Cow hocks IS a problem within the breed and it is not looked upon as seriously as it should be. It seems it is being slipped under the carpet to allow a platform for screaming about Double Handling and now the new suggestion of Judges being licensed!!!! These two issues are NOT important, the correct movement of a supposed workiing dog is!
This is of course only my own opinion and based on what I have seen and heard and read. No doubt my second paragraph will be jumped upon from a great height, but so be it.
Frank
by Jemima Harrison on 11 December 2009 - 13:12
Jemima
by bazza on 11 December 2009 - 13:12
by missbeeb on 11 December 2009 - 13:12
Frank, it's Jemima alright and it matters little what we say... there's no SHOWTIME in praticalities; who'd want to hear about progress?
We do have hocky dogs and all responsible breeders are trying to ensure that this problem is corrected, but these dogs are not crippled, they're unsound... yes, they should be penalised by EVERY judge to ensure that all breeders take heed. Over angulation and or long hocks are part if not all of the problem; not so tough to eradicate.
Double handling: it's really not an issue, IF it's an "all breeds" show, it should not be practised imo, however, at GSD only shows... why not? Is the rest of the world wrong then? It's practised in every country they have dog shows! The KC don't like "us", we're too pushy, we're too demanding... fancy asking for health checks to be mandatory, fancy asking for a two tier registration system, fancy introducing hip scoring, various testings etc, etc... what a bloody sauce eh? Anyone could be excused for thinking we had our dogs welfare at heart!
Jemima, I know you remember well the last thread about PDE on hear and we all know that we can no longer access them, however, I do know of at least one person that printed the whole thread off, so... if absolutely necessary, I can provide proof. God knows why I should feel so inclined, the truth really isn't your bag, is it? You certainly never seem to let it get in your way!
I understand that you may be making another programme on a similar thread... if you are and you really do want to help pedigree dogs, please speak to the GSD partnership (Joe Summerhill) about how you could help, there's much you could do.
by peterlee on 11 December 2009 - 14:12
The question is what is the GSD fraternity going to do to ensure that the animals they produce actually are healthy and sound and how do they PROVE that they are. A KC pedigree doesn’t do that. And no amount of shouting and ranting will prove it. A system is what is required. The Germans have it. You all know it. If the GSD community in the UK does not have a similar system then don’t shoot the messenger for pointing that out.
by Trotters123 on 11 December 2009 - 14:12
Double handling: it's really not an issue, IF it's an "all breeds" show, it should not be practised imo, however, at GSD only shows... why not? Is the rest of the world wrong then? It's practised in every country they have dog shows! The KC don't like "us", we're too pushy, we're too demanding... fancy asking for health checks to be mandatory, fancy asking for a two tier registration system, fancy introducing hip scoring, various testings etc, etc... what a bloody sauce eh? Anyone could be excused for thinking we had our dogs welfare at heart!
Missbeeb I thank the Lord that someone in the GSD community actually holds their hands up and admits about the cow hocks. Thank you.
I actually agree in sentiment what your second paragraph states.
Frank
by bazza on 11 December 2009 - 15:12
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