Can't keep her attention - Page 2

Dobermannman:  I didn't miss anything, darlin' - but I suspect you and everyone else treating LSU like a total beginner may have ...
Linda.

Well, I was going to say you have to find a way to be more interesting to her than the dragonflies and other distractions, which, I guess could be interpreted as 'you're boring her'... Dobermann needs to work on his tact, though...LOL!

Make sure you aren't taking her outside JUST to train. If she gets playtime outside, she will get used to the dragonflies and strange noises.

Remember, she's still a pup, and won't have a long concentration span. Keep your training sessions short, and don't do the same exercise over and over and over.

Work on the 'look at me!' command indoors, using treats, then transfer that to outdoors. I had a dog that was very very nervous, and the trainer told me I needed to REALLY work on attention and focus with her at home, so that it would become automatic when she was in the stressful environment of the training class (and just about anywhere else I took her).

Michael Ellis's DVD on 'attention and focus' is REALLY good.

dobermann,
It's not about style, that's the whole problem, designer training is crap, and what has worked all these years is still sound training.
Less confrontational?
Please...........................................
How confrontational is traffic, or a stray dog coming at you?
How can you teach anything without focus on the trainer, not what's in the trainers pocket?
The longe line will provide that focus quite well and saves dogs from confrontation.
As well as proper socializing and the bond created between dog and man through love and respect.

I have a great deal of experience with all of the above and while I use many tricks and methods, focus is the foundation.

Moons.

I have a 7 month old pup male and hé is walked almost i parks, beach, forest always without leash you need a clicker , very nice treats and try and click her at training when she is looking at you by herself this exersice is very good because the dog learns by keeping focus ón the handler pays of at the handler has great things like food and playtime When you are outside at she by herself takes contact with you click and reward dó it often so she fast get the idea that If she want to dó somerhing she is to go by you and ofcourse let her have time outside to run free and still click her she is taking contact with you

Soooo,
If I have a clicker, and treats in my pocket, what will your dog do?

Moons.

I wonder what my dogs would do if a stranger would come in the yard with a clicker and a bag of treats.  I'm pretty sure that stranger would have to back off.  If not, I would question my trainer let me tell you that...

 

Myret, so what happens if you lose the clicker? Is your dog still going to obey you?

The problem with gimmicks like clickers, shake cans and throw chains is they are objects. You don't want your dog to focus on an object, you want him to focus on YOU! That is what Moons is trying to say.

I've heard of dogs that won't work unless the handler has treats. This is WRONG.

I've also seen dogs that had absolute ZERO respect for family members, and only respected the gimmick: shake can or anti-bark collar. In the case of the collar, the dog refused to let anyone close enough to put it on him. The had to call their son, the dog's owner, downstairs to do it.  With the shake can, the dog totally ignored everything that was being said to him, until someone found the darn thing, and shook it. Then he finally shut up, and scooted behind the sofa!

Good training is all about building a relationship with the dog. You can't do that with abuse and harsh corrections. The dog will never trust you. You can't do it solely with clickers and treats, either.

It's fashionable to sneer at Kohler now. Yes, there were some things in his methods that you should NEVER do, like taping a dog's mouth shut, or trying to drown it in the hole it's dug in your yard. Funny, most of the sneerers have never even read his book. That's a shame, because most of what he teaches is correct. Did you know he trained CATS for Walt Disney movies? (The Incredible Journey, That Darn Cat). You can't train cats with harsh, abusive methods. It just won't work!

He was head animal trainer for Walt Disney studios for many years.

Vero, Moons has likely been training dogs in schutzhund longer than you've been alive. Don't sneer at him. That attitude doesn't look good on ya!

Back when he and I first began training our GSDs, Kohler's book was just about all there was.

First, I really didn't mean to sneer.  So sorry about that.  I'm French so sometimes I use the wrong words.  (By the way, I once used, talking to a client : are you a bachelor ?  (I wanted to say : do you have a degree ?  Sometimes words in French don't mean the same thing in English)...  I also said "Please meet my ant" ...of course I wanted to introduce some collegues to my aunt...

I trained my first dog (17 years ago) with an experienced Schutzhund trainer that was using old school methods.  I didn't always felt comfortable with his methods and advices.  My dog was really obedient and pretty good at protection work.  

I now train my dog with a guy I feel experienced and that guy uses a completely different approach.  I really feel comfortable with his methods.  Always.  But what I like most, my dog seems happy to work.  I don't know how to express that, but when my dog sees the training stuff, she is so excited, she is always willing to learn new stuff.  I didn't feel that with my first dog.  My first dog was working 'cause he had to do.

I don't mean that's because of the training method, maybe it's a dog attitude, my first one was not as good as my second.  Maybe it's evolution, maybe today's dogs are better, I really don't know.

And I just wanted to add that it's not because somebody have been doing something for more than 35 years that makes the method accurate and up to date.  In my profession, I need to adapt to new data, new methods, new tests, new diagnosis, new medication almost every week.   Same thing with dog world, in my opinion. I learn new stuff everyday.

I agree with you, Vero. I don't train the same way I did back when I got my first GSD in the 1980s. Things have changed a lot, and I think overly harsh methods may have been the reason you dog wasn't enthusiastic about his work.

Just as there was good and bad trainers back then, there are good and bad trainers now. My training methods are much more positive and upbeat than they were back then, but I totally disagree that a dog like a GSD can be trained with ALL positive methods. Never saying 'no' to your kids produced rebellious spoiled brats, and I believe it does the same thing for dogs.

sunsilver

If Im out walking the pup or the female adult I rarely have the clicker with me because I often forget it  is a tool I have used for in the early training with my dogs and when they are going to learn new things

When Im out walking the pup he is without leash when we are in places with no cars of course he is still as obedient as if I dont have the clicker he stays around 5-10 meters from me and even if there are other dogs or pups he rarely anymore goes to them to play he can meet other dogs but he is surely to be keeping an eye on me for sure , I must remember he is a puppy  and nothing is for sure yet but he sure is attentive for a male pup his age and its almost  only  due to the training

my male dog when he was a pup clicker was not used 14 years ago, he was not so obedient as my new pup at the age of 7 months but my old male could alot more exersices at the same age as the new pup I have I just let him be a pup and we train alot of shaping behavior at eating time because I want him working for me and the clicker is only a tool to mark the right behavior


my female is also very obedient when out running but ofcourse they are dogs so I dont trust them if something like a cat or something is coming they will chase the cat

the female I have is very intense in training not just with a clicker but when I started her in focus training I used a clicker mostly and today she is very attentive but I have som pics of her ans me training OB after a litle walk with no clicker so I will try almost same method with the pup both with alot more shape training than only the lure as is the way she has learned focus