Older dogs and teaching take it with dumbbell - Page 2

Wow I'm the *exact* opposite as Ulf, lol!  I NEVER want drive FOR the dumbbell itself, for us it is a totally neutral object that the dog must retrieve and bring back (correctly) in order to avoid pressure and get what they really want.  I don't play or tug with dumbbells at all and don't use one for a formal retrieve until I've shaped the entire behavior with a different object (like a wooden dowell).

That`s the  difference VKGSDs, I just like juggling the drives and dont use pressure in that exercice at all. It does not take longer to train that way, quite the opposite, Momo learnt the retrieve in a couple of days, only maintainence and polishing to do since and her retrieve is very fast and reliable.
All the best
Ulf

I don't always use pressure either, just depends on the dog.  My older dog got no pressure, totally freeshaped with rewards.  My younger dog gets a combination (just started his retrieve this month).  I do a lot of play and retrieving with other objects (and both my SchH dogs also do flyball, which is like one big, long, fast, complicated retrieve) but approach the competition retrieve more formally.  No right or wrong, just different means to the same end!  I can't do prey for a dumbbell with my older dog because it creates chewing (I absolutely do not tolerate *any* chewing, loose grip, rolling the dumbbell, etc) nor does it work with my younger dog b/c he has such high prey drive he overloads and I only want calm, deliberate behaviors in formal obedience.

I do not tolerate chewing and rolling either, but my dogs do not chew and they are drive monsters.
Just recently I had someone at my training with a four year old GSD female, very high prey drive.
He told me she chews heavily the dummbell and if I could sort it out,he showed me the dumbbell he used, it looked very worn down.
I told him I will fix it and he did not need to show me the retrieve, as I believe it`s always the same cause.He got her out and we started.
It took only 3 minutes or so and the dog did not chew once during the exercises. I did not touch the dog and the handler didn`t either, no compulsion, no jerkes , no touching the dog or the dumbbell and at the end the dog sat static with the dumbbell in her mouth .no chewing or rolling, just waiting for the command to drop it. I also fixed the chewing the dumbbell of a eight year old GSD male with extreme drive. He was chewing heavily as well and I fixed that in minutes in the same way.
All the best
Ulf
 

That's great, I have no doubt it works, but I don't train drive monsters or extreme drive.  It's just not my personal preference.  Also given some of the exercises we do for other venues of training, it's important to me that my dogs never view the object they are retrieving as a toy or something they might want to play with.  It wouldn't matter to me for SchH competition but overall it doesn't fit with how and what we train.

Wow, thank you guys! My girl loves to play with me and really enjoys a good game of tug, she will retrieve balls etc no problem, has crazy prey drive for anything moving quick. it is just the dumbbell, I can't even get her to put it in her mouth, but due to her prey drive she will run after it when I throw it very quickly, but will just look at it when it lands and run back to me empty mouthed. I have spent the last month fawning over the dumbell though and not letting her have it, she is now starting to show interest in it so I plan to try and reintroduce the take it soon. In the meantime we moved on to introducing jumping and she is loving jumping, so am hoping I can combine the two for interest in the dumbbell.

I teach the dog to "hold" the dumbbell first before doing the actual retrieve.  We spend several weeks learning the proper calm, strong hold sitting in front so the dog knows to take it and clamp down hard until I say "aus".  They learn "take it", "hold", and "aus" this way.  Once they understand I want them to do the formal front sit and hold the dumbbell until I say otherwise, we start building the retrieve part.