Kennel Pacing -- need help - Page 2

Kitkat, my son is showing interest in dog handling, and we plan to get him started in that direction this summer. My dog has a great job, though, being our pet, and it would be incorrect to think he is not stimulated to function with a purpose in his daily existence doing just that. I think I know what compulsive behavior looks like, so I'll have to respectfully disagree. He can be re-directed and we make sure to do that, and don't laugh and encourage the behavior in any way. And like I said, if he has lacked exercise because of rain maybe, he tends to have the energy to pace at certain times. I agree with YR that the dog likes to be tired. I hope it is a compliment that you think my showline could do other work, more in line with the dogsports and careers favored on the PDB.nbsp

by beetree 

 

   WHY IS EVERTHING I SAY TAKEN OUT OF CONTEXT???????????

My dogs are "nothing BUT my pets"! They live in the house with me, 24-7. My older female Lacy, NEEDS A JOB TO BE DOING. Plain, and simple. SHE will DRAG rocks around the yard, all day long, for something to do . Sadie is the same way.

    They will both "gladly exchange a rock", for me. I DO NOT STATE, these dogs have OCD, HOWEVER...SOME DO!

   I also did not state you laugh or encourage this behavior(WTF).

   ALL I'm saying is Your Dog Wants(and needs) to be BUSY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Like I said, most of the time the dogs are in the house with me.  However, Hollie has always been a couch potato, happy to lie around.   She has hip dysplasia, so she gets mild exercise, walks, romps in front yard (4 acres).  Tracking tires her out best.  The other two are the higher drive and they definitely need a job and training.  LOL, the older one I can run her miles on the bike and she is still ready to go.  However she is calm in the kennel, and happy to be out there when I take her.  I have had Hollie  since she was 5mo.  It is necessary sometimes to place them out in the kennel, especially if I have a house full of kids running in and out.  The other two would rather be outside there than in the house if I am gone shopping or running errands for several hours.  I hate to have them crated for long and thought an outdoor kennel run where they could move around inside and outside and relieve themselves would be better than being crated.    They are all part of the family, and lay under the tables when we eat and watch tv.   They sleep in the house at night.  They go with me when I take the kids to school, to ball games, to soccer practice and swim in our pool.  I have large crates in the family room to separate them if necessary.    I guess Hollie will be just my strictly indoor dog.

The Germans have a word for it.. They call it "Laufwillen", the desire to run.
I had GSDs for twenty five years and never really understood the breed completely until I saw Ed Frawley's tape on Continental Herding. Our dogs are herding dogs, and we all know this, but you need to understand that this is a different type of herding than what a border collie does, or a Kuvasz, etc. These GSDs are used in pairs to create a "living fence". They help to herd a lot of sheep to a grazing pasture, which is usually square, and then they each take up two sides and one corner of the lot and they pace up and down, all day, glancing towards the flock and the shepherd, and each other. If any sheep breaks from the herd and starts to head over to an adjacent field, planted with crops, the closest dog has to dart in and chase it back to the flock (without running the others off). Sometimes they grab a bit of wool and shake, then release. The sheep have respect for the dogs! When the sheep returns to the flock, the GSD must release and go back to patroling the perimeter of the field. They go up one side of the field, turn 90 degrees at the corner, and go up the other side of the field, then they turn around and do the same thing in reverse. They do this all day, at a leisurely, sustainable pace. This is why so much emphasis is placed on the gait of these dogs, at a trot. They call it the flying trot, and the real herding dogs do not really go at this fast pace, but they must have efficient movement to stay at a sustainable pace all day long.

OK.. So, anything that moves is going to get these dogs attention, and that includes each other. They are definitely an "OCD" breed and will do this compulsively, all day long, if there is any stimulation. GSDs for this reason do not really do well in kennels. It is a behavioral problem. In a kennel, they will actually use smeared fecal material as a sort of lubricant, like one of those plastic things the kids slide on when playing in water in the summer. They get the same effect in mud. One bitch of mine would go even faster when there was mud, and you could tell she was really having a great time! They enjoy doing this! It is seldom about stress.. They will also leave brown spots (feces) on the wall, because they push off of the ends of the run, just like a swimmer would do in swimming laps. Or, they will run laps around a yard. How big of a yard has nothing to do with it. You give them a big yard, and they will run around that until there is a trench in the ground, or packed dirt in a circle. I've seen these dogs herd flies! I am serious! Yes, dogs need exercise, but not THIS much! They also need REST!!!! If allowed to pace in a kennel all day long, a dog with extreme "Laufwillen" will soon look like an overtrained marathon runner, or a survivor from a death camp! No matter how much you feed them, they will never gain weight.

It is unreasonable to say to someone that they cannot do anything for twelve years or more while the dog lives, and that the dog must always be with them. That is not possible! The answer is not in one thing, but in many. Limit exercise even if it means some forced rest periods (crate time or room time). Increase caloric content in feedings.. I have only recently found out that most commercial dog foods do not have sufficient fat, and I've had a lot of luck in feeding about 2 Tablespoons to 1/4 cup of lard (yes, lard) to their feedings. Does wonders for the coat, too! If you can manage it, it's best to give the dog some purpose.. train it to do something and give it a chance to do that thing every day. These are intelligent dogs and if they don't have something to do, they can become quite neurotic in the kennel.

One caviat.. Do not overfeed fat or lard. I would give no more than 1/4 cup a day. I have heard that more can be hard on the pancreas and can cause pancreatitis. That c

Thanks DDR-DSH, a very informative post, for me. I feel bad I don't have any sheep herding for my guy, I know he'd be great, and he does have that "I can go all day like this if you want", trot. I think he'd love grabbing a bit of wool, give it a shake, let go, and get on with the job.

(And my guy follows me around because he wants to, no separation anxiety whatsoever.)

Emotional blackmail.

 

One of the challenges of having any dog that is used to spending a lot of time with you is that, aside from boredom, they can also develop certain behaviors that are symptomatic of "separation anxiety". 

OCD behaviors need to be interrupted/redirected. It also responds to medication.

Separation anxiety needs a different type of intervention - behavioral and/or medication or possibly an herbal remedy.

Dealing with both needs an investment of time, and may need to be dealt with periodically if it flares up.

Some dogs develop OCD because of trait anxiety. If this is the case, they may actually begin another OCD behavior to replace a previous one that it can no longer do. Some dogs get into SIBs (self-injusrious behaviors like licking or chewing on themselves.) It's like dealing with addicts. If the only problem is the pacing, It's not that bad. In this situation it is due to state anxiety (as opposed to trait anxiety.) OCD is a pathological condition that is not very easily redirected. OCD is an extreme expression of an anxious personality type. The illness is the anxiety. The repetive, consuming behaviors exist to relieve anxiety. Take away the anxiety, the behaviors may cease completely or become much less frequent.

You don't always need to take an all-or-nothing approach. Try a combination. Don't be afraid to crate her for short periods even if you don't want to make a habit out of it. It will give her a break from the pacing. If you think there might be an anxiety component, try a calming herbal plug in. Leave her with a toy or a chew in the kennel if there is something like that she really gets into that would distract her. You may not need to completely stop the pacing. If you're very busy, do something a little different each day with a short period of being crated. A little variety might also help.  

DDR-DSH:

Wow!  that was interesting.  I was beginning to think my male had OCD.  Every time he's let out of the house, he has a "ritual".  We live on a wooded acreage.  He immediately cuts through the woods to the road at the bottom of the property ,  barks 4 or 5 barks at the neighbour's (much to the dismay of our neighbours) then runs around up through the woods again up about 100 yards to the right of the house, up through the woods at the back of the house, before coming down about 20 yards to the left of the house, then back up on the porch.  We always joke he's taking himself for a run - but perhaps it's a part of his "perimeter" watch ancestry? 

Is there anywhere you can swim your dogs? Especially the girl whose hips are not so great.. you will find it will greatly tire her.. at the same time strengthen her body and muscles
We have been swimming for rehab and I've recently started both my new dogs (9 weeks old.. so cute in the pool and the 14 month old)......
There are many dogs with joints not so good who still need tons of exercise... some dogs don't know they have anything wrong so be practical and use supplements but remember she can't read xrays!!

I have seen pacing in a lot of dogs from all lines... think its too broad a subject to give it one reason why it occurs but more exercise should help and why is a crae any different than a kennel.. if the dog is happy there???

All my dogs spend times in their crates every day.. ragardless of their age or "status"