For Californians: !! AB 1634 Alert !! - Page 2

Police dogs with no balls!!!!

Pharaoh said "NO WAY"

Michele and Pharaoh

Bump.

(p.s.  LOL re: Pharaoh's comment!)

 (thank you to animules.. didn't know what "bump" meant.  now I do )

Definitely act now if you haven't already.  This is Levine's last ditch attempt at getting back at pet owners.  Last election, we passed term limits that meant Levine is now termed out of the state Assembly.  He tried running for senator, but got beat in the primary, largely because of support of pro-pet organizations to his competitor's campaign.  Don't let him win!!!!!  Mail your senator a letter, call their office, or maybe even drop by and voice your (logical) opinion. 

Taken to it's ridiculous extreme, if this law passes, the PETA folks can just show up at a dog show, and have 3 people file a complaint against any dog they find. Then your dog will end up spayed or neutered whether or not the complaints are valid or not.  There is no appeal process, or exemption for animals that may have medical conditions that make these operations dangerous for them. 

D2

the revised bill allows for a dog to be neutered after it  has been picked up as a stray for the 3rd tme.   the 3rd time a dog has been cited for being a nuisance too, but  barking/noise is not included.

here is the revised bill

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/07-08/bill/asm/ab_1601-1650/ab_1634_bill_20080701_amended_sen_v90.pdf

how do you defend not altering an animal if the numbnuts owner has demonstrated irresponsible pet ownership time and time again?

This is just one more attempt by the shadow gov't to attack freedom on every front.  End game is to take away all our rights and create a fabian socialist/fascist nation where the large int'l corporations are merged with the govt and run society according to the shadow govt's agenda.  The folks pushing this legislation could care less about the welfare of dogs or any animals.  They just want to erode freedom as part of their master plan to destroy the USA and mold it into a north american union (merger of Mehico, Canada and the USA).  Actually many of these shadow govt folks hate animals and their owners and are sexual degenerates and perverts.  If you want to know what the shadow govt rulers are really like (the string pullers at the pinnacles of power) and can handle the truth, google "mark dutroux", or "the pink symphonies" or "kay griggs", or the "franklin cover-up", or "Johnny Gosch", or "the finders", etc.

Of course you could read Carl Raschke's book, Painted Black,  or the Ultimate Evil by Maury Terry, or "Programmed to Kill" by David McGowan, or "Secret Societies and Psychological Warfare" by Michael A. Hoffman II.  Or Check out the "smiley face murders" as reported on KSTP Television in Minneapolis, MN and then search out the top so called animal welfare orgs that claim to care so much animals and see which one uses the same logo and has a very bad history. Then connect the dots and you will finally understand the animals rights scam that is being shoved down our throats and why.  I know this stuff is very hard to fit into your head, but I suggest you keep an open mind, do the research and connect the dots and you will understand that right now we have criminals in high places in law enforcement, state and fed govt, the judiciary and most large police depts, as well as defense, state dept and intel. I have informed several folks who visit this forum of actual facts, specifics and names and they know what I say is true because they have verified it for themselves.  If you do careful research on this, do not be surprised to find out that it has been alleged by informants that at least one of these so called animal rights groups actually rescues dogs to use in very sick ritual sacrifices.

This onslaught to take away our freedom to breed our beloved pets under the false flag of so called "animal welfare" is just the tip of the iceberg and is part of a coordinated effort to take away all our Constitutional freedoms, to destroy our Bill of Rights and to actually destroy our great nation. 

Ah Sue if life could be so simple. This is a finely crafted piece of legislation with several agendas and designed to elict just such a response as you gave so people will not critically analyze the bill, it's intended and unintended consequences and the costs involved in it.  May I suggest you read this thread  and the posts by myself and VKFGSD since they deal with very similar issues.    http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/bulletins_read/204974.html#205655   . However I will try to summarize why I feel this bill must be opposed.

When analyzing any legislation the important thing is NOT what the stated or intended consequence is the important thing is to analyze it from the perspective of what are the likely unintended OR UNDISCLOSED consequences (see other thread for info) .   First of all the current version of the bill contains no due process requirements which constitutionally are required because in CA animals are property and this would constitute a taking. This was NOT an accident in drafting, First of all it avoids a discussion of the cost of meeting those due process requirements which would be huge to local jurisdictions and could cause the defeat of the bill. Secondly unless someone has a spare $500,000 or so to mount a constitutional challenge ( not I) the govt gets away w/ violating our due process and basically gets to set their own rules irregardless of the law. If that happens with Peta and HSUS money and legislative agenda - kiss your dogs goodby.  Thirdly even IF a challenge is mounted ( a no the court is not a good place to try to stop a law like this -inevitably the result satisfies neither party), the corts will look to legislative intent.  And that Dear Heart is why this law does not say what you think it says.  Go to www.saveourdogs.net and read Levine's statements.  He did NOT make these just to hear himself talk. He knows how this works.  He repeatedly stated in the hearing that being intact was a violation all on it's own - that is legislative intent. So it is NOT a matter of 3 strikes and you are out for running abroad. It then becomes a matter of ANY contact w/ AC (and several CA jursdictions are sending officers door to door to check on the status of animals or they can just stop you on the street walking your dog) gives rise to inquiry about the intact status of your animal and that immediately becomes an infraction.

Finally remember that it is by far easier to amend a law that is already on the books than to create a new one. So in many cases the opposition will take just about anything to get a law on the books because they know that they can come back in a year and tack an amendment on an obscure unrelated bill at the last minute and it likely will pass with no one even noticing. Levine has plentyof co-horts in the legislature that would be happy to do that for their share of HSUS millions of campaign dolars.  So please think long and hard before you support legislation that restricts our rights and can give them a foot in the door to future easy amendments. 

Also it is also important NOT to make assumptions about how and when and where it will be enforced. If it is on the books it can be enforced. A good analogy is the broken car tail light. As my retired LEO friend says - do you know how many felony arrests are made based on a broken tail light? ( Answer for those who do not get it - boatloads - it is used as an excuse/raison to initiate contact).  Continued

Other reasons for opposing this bill include what VKF outlined above - "Part of the reason the current version of AB1634 needs to be defeated is that shelter population issues in California vary greatly from place to place. This is a local jurisdiction issue and there are sufficient laws on the books ( if they were enforced) to deal with any problems as shown by the counties that go elsewhere to get adoptable dogs . We need to tell our legislators that this is a local jurisdiction issue and there is no need for a state mandate that will impose horrendous costs ( monetary and constitutional). It ignores the facts that California shelter populations have FALLEN by 76% over the last thirty years (official state statistics) and it penalizes the communites that have done a good job by imposing regulations and costs that they don't need." - by the way that decrease happened whilel human AND pet populations were rising steeply in CA so it is even more impressive.

What HAS been shown to work to reduce shelter populations is education, education, education. MSN has NOT worked in any jurisdicion that it has been adopted in - both shelter populations AND costs rise. And make no bones about it this is still a MSN bill - one with NO exemptions for anyone.

I have a friend that works with her local animal shelter. In the winter when we have a big blow they know their stray dog count will rise - cause fences are blown down. They even know where to go pick them up - the poor section of town where people don't have the money to fix the fences. Now if we pass this bill what will happen to shelter populations in this town? Guess what they will rise. Faced with MSN the response will be here take this dog/cat I can't afford that (please note this is a proven phenomena in local jurisdictions that have adopted MSN). Do you think a better solution might be to get a Federal Neighborhood Improvemnt Grant and help these people fix their fences? Or have the vet students from Davis come down on break and offer free MSN and some education and training. OR OR OR. There are many BETTER solutions - all costing less than this bill.

I have said all along that this bill is about full employment for AC officers. Follow the money and it is very enlightening. Despite steeply declining shelter populations budgets have been increasing by 25, 40, 60%. We need to start holding their feet to the fire about where that money is going to.  We all also need to  take VKF's suggestions on the other thread and educate ourselves about the PETA/HSUS legislative agenda. Please Please at a minimum read   http://www.pet-law.com/future/future1.html  and if you can get a copy of it the Strand book "The Hijacking of the Humane Movement. You might also want to read Nathan Winograd's book Redemption. Much of the info in it is available on his websites. I don't agree with everything he says but he offers a lot of very useful info and a very interesting perspective to these issues. http://www.nathanwinograd.com/       http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/reforming-animal-control.html 

bump

probably why levine didn't try to amend the calif potentially dangerous/vicious dog law to include mandatory altering.  that current law does provide due process.

i have been against levine and  ab1634 since the beginning and was wondering what he was trying to slip by!!!

Here's a much better idea.

Low cost and NO COST spay and neuter clinics. This could be funded by the extra license fees (which I already pay) for intact animals. Perhaps there could be accomodation for licensed breeders in rural areas-a group rate.

There are non-profit clinics, more of them need to be located in ghetto and poor rural counties in California (Lake County is infamous).

Education and a sliding scale-or FREE for targeted zones.

Planned Parenthood has certainly adopted this business model. Lots of abortion clinics located near inner city areas. The same areas where pit bulls are loose in the streets.

The county I live in has to import strays from other counties or states or countries.

Michele and Pharaoh

PS. Maybe the stupid wackos in the state legislature should be doing their job-work on the overdue budget!!!!!!