Caper's Acres are you joking? - Page 2

Blitz is cowhocked, fine boned,  has a short croup, a gay tail, is  east-west, has weak pasterns and bad feet, is missing a P1 and cannot be trusted around strangers. He's 100% German showlines. KKL1, V rated in Germany, Sch III sire. His pedigree has many well known dogs in it. Some of the photos of imports posted on this board make the Caper dogs look good, especially those of dogs with very pronounced roaches being advertised as - world class dog for breeding and showing. If every photo posted here were first reviewed by a panel of canine anatomy experts, not all would receive approval to be published.

The AKC people set up the dogs to look that way, Sueincc. For some unknown reason, they think it looks good. Many of the American lines I've seen are hock walkers because they are too angulated behind with weak ligaments while others are sound behind in spite of the way they look on their photos. There's just no way I know of to tell which is which just by looking at a show photo of an AKC dog.

Gringo was imported by Dan Smith I think, they must have bought him from Dan. He's still on Dan's website and looks like a pretty nice dog.

Forgive my denseness, but when you say "Blitz" are you talking about your dog or a dog on the Capers Acre site?  I agree with you 100% that many of the titled and kk'ed German line dogs leave a whole lot to be desired.  I just feel the German lines (working and show) are on average head and shoulders superior and more correct than their American show line counterparts.  I use to go to AKC shows (I groomed show standard poodles).  When I would take a look at the GSD ring I always felt dismayed at the way the dogs seemed to be paddling with their front legs which were so down in the pasterns and walking on their hocks in the back.  It wasn't one or two dogs, but all of them.  I saw spooky dogs being put up too.   It got to the point where I purposely avoided the GSD ring because it was so depressing.

I know there is always some argument between show vs working or show vs hunting in many breeds.  Was this true with the Malamute too?  I've always loved the breed, but noticed some breeders advertise "giant" dogs which we all know usually means the breeder isn't breeding to the standard regardless of the breed!  I wnder if some breed for weight pulls or other sports and some breed for conformation ring?  Anyway, I think they are wonderful dogs!

Blitz is my dog, Sueincc, I wouldn't say that about anyone else's dog . We love him and he's here to stay, but he is a PIA at times.

I've been watching AKC GSD's since the 70's and every  year I see fewer and fewer dogs in that ring that I consider sound or I would want to show or breed myself.  IMO Dallas was a great dog, one that could have held his own with most imports conformation wise. Moses said he could do Sch, but I never saw that. However, he did prove himself as a herding dog.  I try to keep an open mind about this breed and dogs in general and study both the Am lines and the imports. I have a soft spot for most GSD's and most dogs in general. Not being a breeder, I would not reject an American line dog as a pet. If I were a breeder, I'd not be interested in most.

The giant breeders are the outlaws of the Malamute world. The breed standard asks for a medium sized dog, 25" for males, 23" for females, 85 and 75 pounds respectively. There is no size DQ.  At one time this breed did zip in the group ring until breeders started to breed for more substance and angulation, thus the big side gait that AKC judges go nuts over (sound familiar?).  As a result, the legs are too short on most, the heads way too heavy and the muzzles so short and bulky that missing teeth and bad bites are common and some dogs can't get around the ring without panting like  freight trains - no patent airways due to an overly long soft palates and tongues that are too long to fit indside their mouths when ithey are closed.  For every action there is a reaction. We are also losing the beautiful almond shaped eyes; the shortening of the muzzles and too much stop causes the eyes to become round, too deeply set and I think that really spoils the expression not to mention it is not a survival characteristic. Sadly I see many of these concerns in some imported GSD's, not so much in the American dogs, they seem to bring their own set of problems to the table. Generally speaking the bigger, less angulated dogs are the best weight pullers, but lack the endurance to be able to work on a freighting team.  I know many imported lovers consider the Am lines to be too fine boned, but I'm not so sure that is true from a working standpoint. Anyway, with Mals, too big and straight, not enough agility and endurance, too small and too heavily angulated, not enough strength to get the job done. It's all about moderation for this breed. Most Mals are very strong; I 've seen a 90 lb Mal pull a U-Haul van 30 feet on a flat, paved surface and he barely broke a sweat.

In today's world freighting dogs have been replaced by jet skis and the Inuits no longer lead a nomadic life, so the only performance tests for Malamutes are fun things like back packing, skijoring, recreational sledding.  As far as I know only 1 team of Mals ever competed in the Iditarod and they scrathed early on due to foot problems, many had long toes with soft pasterns and thin pads, they became quite lame within the first 100 miles or so. Bad feet, bad sled dog. It's all about survival.

Thank you gsd fan...

Blitzen:  I appreciate your answer.  Once again, I have learned from your posts.  Thanks!

Figures... Pennsylvania.

Anyone see the latest copy of Dog World? They are featuring the Shiloh Shepherd. The article would make the average pet owner completely avoid any dog I have and go directly to one of the MANY Shiloh Shepherd breeders in this state.

Thanks a lot Dog World. Now I know why I still have 3 beautiful working dog pups at 14 weeks old sitting here, priced lower than the crap being sold all around me.

Grrrrrrrr

SS

I think that it is a good thing that Ambreds are showing up here. 

These are AKC registered dogs that have been shown in GSDCA rings.  Now that the AKC has approved WDS, these dogs, (or progeny) may train and attempt titles.  Silly divisions in the breed only weaken the breed.  Not to mention they frighten away newcomes, without which our breed and sport will die.

Working line people will not go to AKC shows, AKC people have been similarly disdainful of German style showing/ trials.  When does it stop?  The fact that these people have brought in a German male tells me that they may be willing to be brought into the working sport.  If they even start trialing at a local level, it is a gain for the breed.  Who says a good dog cannot be "pretty"? 

No, this is not an endorsement of some of the silliness that parades around all of the show rings.  The division didn't happen overnight and the end of it will not be that fast either.

Welcome to the PDB, Capers Acres

Lorri

Perhaps it would help if the AKC/GSDCA  would use the same standard as the FCI/SV.

You're welcome, Sue. I don't know why I waited so long to get my first GSD .

IMO the AKC standard is very similar to the SV's.  If you log on to the GSDCA.ORG site there is an icon for Illustrated Standard which is very interesting and might provoke some discussion on the differences and the similarities between the FCI/SV standard and AKC's. I think the authors of both standards had the same type dog in mind; over time the breeders revised that type to match with was/is being shown today and that continues. To me, today's AKC show dog looks little like the "ideal dog" in the IS.  I've heard they are going to revise the IS as many don't care for the current one. The breed standard will probably stay the basically the same, the drawings will be updated . Is there an illustrated standard that addresses the SV/FCI breed standard?