What should I expect.? - Page 1

       
                 Thanks to everyone who gave their input on my other threads with regard to Ruger..aka 'Prince"
 We are starting our first class with a Schutzhund training club on Monday.....I have always attended  AKC training classes in the past and Prince's aggressive behavior toward strangers was not addressed by the trainers at all. They said that he would grow out of it........... I have taken the advice from those on this board and have been socializing him at a distance from people. He does not mind people at a distance, however when they walk toward us he will lunge, bark and growl......The Shutzhund trainers met Prince one time about 6 weeks ago to evaluate him. We are now starting our intermediate obedience class and I am a little nervous about what to expect. How do trainers usually handle this type of behavior in a 6 month old ???.....................Thanks Ruger1

There are so many different trainers out there and different ways to tackle this.
With a 6 months old I personally would work on exposure to lots of strangers, training the dog to finally ignore them by turning his entire attention onto you, as handler, through obedience practice, giving commands as Sit Heel etc.
Some trainers use force to make the dog totally submissive as soon as he tries to charge a stranger, but eventually this will cause other problems and I don't recommend that.

I can't speak for others training methods,
But I would close the gap, I don't think socializing can be done at a distance.

The earlier the better and it's an ongoing process.
At six months and usually for me closer to four months I start my pups on a long line as a foundation for everything that is to follow.

Good luck with it.

Moons.

                         
          Tingiesand Tails.....As you have suggested I have been teaching Prince to ignore and focus on me. But, there have been times as the person walks away it spikes his aggression and out of the blue he lunges at them from behind. I really do not know what to make of this behavior .......????

       Moons....just give me a pinch more of your insight on this.....Have you ever worked with this type of temperament? How would you handle this behavior in your own dog...???

                 Also....I guess It is not really fair to say strangers, but rather most people outside of our immediate family with only a few exceptions.                          
 
                Also, Also, I guess what I am really worrying about is that this trainer might use a 'heavy hand' for lack of a better word to control my male?????I just want to make sure the right thing is done to correct this......I think they may have a reputation for being 'heavy handed" however, this is hear-say..... 

                                                      Ruger1

I imagine a lot will depend upon how much of this is coming 'down the leash' to the dog.

Your dog needs a "heavy hand" and needs to be corrected for his inappropriate aggression.  This type of behavior can not be tolerated and being soft will only make it worse.  You need to learn to handle your dog and be very consistent, strong and fair. 

This will only worsen with age and not get better unless you get control of your dog.  There could be a lot of reasons for this behavior, one is a basic insecurity on the dog's part.  You need to recognize what is causing this behavior and address it.  However, regardless of the underlying problem you need to step up and immediately stop this type of behavior. 

FWIW,

Jim

     FHTracker.....At this point there is probably a lot coming down the leash because I have to be very on guard for an abrupt reaction ........it's a vicious circle.......

      Slamdunc....  I have made things very confusing for myself because I have two very different opinions on how to handle this behavior. One is motivational blah..blah,,blah and the other is 'a heavy hand' ......very confusing. 

       Can someone please describe what using 'a heavy hand would look like? I correct him pretty firmly IMO, however, I do not have anything to compare it to.
                                                                                  Thanks Ruger1

     

Ruger1,
You need to take charge and become the boss.  If you are dealing with an aggressive dog correct it effectively and properly.  I doubt you really correct him firmly.  Maybe in your mind you are firm, but your level of firmness doesn't seem to have an affect on him.  I would say firm to you means one thing, but your idea of firm means very little to the dog.  

If you were to rate your dog on a scale of 0 to 10 for hardness or aggression and lets say he is a 6.  Your correction level needs to be at the least a 7 or better an 8 on the same scale.  It appears your idea of firm is more like a 3 or 4 and is not working.  You need to correct him hard enough to stop the undesired behavior immediately and leave a lasting memory so he doesn't do it again in the future.  You are not only correcting for todays bad behavior, but you are correcting for future bad behavior.   You are telling the dog that inappropriate aggression will not be tolerated today or in the future.  

If you provide more details; like how you are correcting the dog and how the dog reacts may shed some light.

Jim

  

"At this point there is probably a lot coming down the leash because I have to be very on guard for an abrupt reaction ........it's a vicious circle......."

Do you question your ability to handle your dog should 'an abrupt reaction' occur? 

If the answer to that is 'yes', then you need to work on YOUR skills even more than you need to work on Prince's.  You can be alert and vigilant without telegraphing nervousness and insecurity down the leash--in fact, you HAVE to learn to do it without telegraphing that stuff, because YOUR emotions are what's lighting your dog's fuse.  You're tense and worried, so he thinks there must be good reason to be tense and worried, too.   Plan out what you will do if 'an abrupt reaction' takes place *before* you're in a situation where it could happen, and then allow yourself to acknowledge that you're capable of taking care of whatever comes your way.  That confidence will markedly reduce the dog's hypervigilance, and you can reverse that vicious circle. 

Ruger1,
You have already answered part of your problem.
Too many cooks in the kitchen and confusion has replaced direction.
No doubt AKC was probably a big joke.
You say your socializing from a distance, close that gap.  
Gradually bring things closer.
This is my best advice, you need someone who can help you in the first person.
No one can help from this distance, and there are a lot of details you haven't furnished here.
A heavy hand takes physical strength and possibly a fight.   
You may not be capable of this yourself.
If it were my dog I would continue socializing, or lets call it desensitizing the dog towards strangers.
I would select people to help who understood what I was doing and I could set up different scenario's.
You do not want to get someone bitten.
At this point I don't know if your dog is aggressive or fearful, it makes a difference.
Thats why my best advice is to find someone who can help you in person there with the dog and yourself.
Hopefully this new trainer will be a good one, I hope you have checked into his history as a trainer.
Honestly, my dogs get alone with everyone, but there are certain people who set them off.
I trust their judgment in such matters, some people are worthy of suspicion and I'm glad my dogs seem to know the difference.
Plus I did all this socializing with humans at a much earlier age which makes things much easier.
If you trust this trainer follow his directions.

Moons.