Black Saddles, where have they gone? - Page 2

It all started with Herman Martin as lead judge. He selected the great Uran as double Sieger. Uran had the half saddle as you can see in his photos. He then selected from Uran many light saddled animals such as Yambo Wildsteiger Land who went select 4 times. Martin had strong saddled males by Uran from which to choose but consistently chose the light saddled animals. Martin continued this through his tenure and Messler did the same thing. Messler would issue warnings on dogs such as Esko v Danischen Hof stating "care should be taken concerning pigment with this dog". Esko's grand fathers are Wobo and Karly both of whom produced many light saddles. As a result today you will read "positive" critiques that state "the dog has large areas of black in his saddle." Martin also eliminated blacks from the SV gene bank. Today light saddles in bitches are predominant. It is very annoying to buy a nice dark saddled bitch only to see the saddle fade as she passes age 2 years.

I saw some puppies out of Dux vom Steinenberger Land with Randy Tyson and Martin Gobl of wildsteiger land kennel. They all had very nice working ability and less of salt and pepper stuff on the back. I think more people should consider this dog for breeding because he seems to produce very well. Ajay Singh www.ajaysingh.com

I have a Timo son. He has cproduced always and I mean 100% black black saddles , mated to over 25 bitches so far.

also very dark masks. But the tan part of the dog is light in some and dark brown in others- sometimes even in the same litter.

1. Movement 2. Movement 3. Movement 4. Movement 5. Movement 6. Front Assembly 7. Complementing Rear Assembly 8. Overall firmness of the dog 9. A pedigree that you can actually do something with 10. Overall Breed type (Note: Color is not on my list)

1. Health 2. Temperament / working character / intelligence 3. Conformation to the breed standard avoiding extreme interpretations 4. Movement / overall agility & athleticism 5. Quality of offspring 6. Pedigree Don't need 10 points on the list. (Note: show rating of parents is not on my list and pedigree, while it has importance is last on the list) Colour? Not important although I do hate to see badly colour paled dogs given high honours. BMK

Excellent list, panzerhund, nice to see health taking the number one spot followed by temperment. It's nice if your dog can really move, but if it's plagued by allergies and nerves, well...what really have you got?

The post asking for the list stated: "Let's put aside the tempeament, hip certificantion and work ethic of GSD, because these three aspects are a given before one considers breeding. What are the next 10 most important aspects used to determine excellence in the GSD? " I considered "Health" as a "Given" as well. The post already included temperament and work ethic. Give me a faded saddle over the over angulated rears, non-existent upper arms, and straight shoulders any day!!

When I posed this question I deliberately left out the given aspects..temperament, work ethic, hip certification and, of course, health concerns. IMO These forgoing concerns are absolutely necessary elements, before we move to evaulated the structure in our dogs. IMO The importance of prioritizing the components of structure is key to arriving at excellence in structure for the breed. If the priorities are reversed by placing minor items infront of the major aspects of structure and movement Then where will we end up? My list would be as follows: 1 & 2 correct angulation with correct length and positioning of the uppper arm and croup..thus creating balance and excellence in movement. 3. correct lay-on of shoulder..with high wither creating good front extention...movement again 4. firm back acting as a transition between the back and front illustrating an excellent drive in the rear and suspension and outreaching gait in the front. 5. a correct depth of chest neither too deep or too high...which enhanses or detracts from movemment. So Kaykohl, I agree with you...movement would occupy the first 5 priorities in evaluating the important aspects and priorities in evaluating GSD in shows and breed surveys. 6. size (height) within the standard of the breed 7. good pigment, which is not the same as the color of a dog 8. the croup..placement and length 8. good propostion head with strong underjaw and correct stop and shape of head 9. Correct ear set without having loose ears 10. tight feet and strong bones Color would be lower on the list. A beautiful black and brown dog is worthless if he doesn't have correct structure and movement. Color is a fad and choice. Good pigment is a requirement.

Hy gimme10mins, in my opinion this is the result of the judges evaluation on shows. They do not pay attention sufficient to correct pigmentation with the dogs at the top. The next is, that breeders are following to this trend. Why they should also, if the judges don't ?