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by Ibrahim on 03 August 2013 - 21:08
It is a sad fact of history that not many follow "the straight path", to which people were called by Jesus. He was followed by a few disciples who were inspired by God to support him. Not only that, but the non-believers plotted (as they did to Muhammad six centuries later) to kill Jesus, but God had a better plan for him and his followers as the Qur'an tells us in the following verses:
And when Jesus perceived their unbelief, he said, 'who will be my helpers in the cause of God? The Apostles said, 'we will be helpers of God.' We believe in God; be witness of our submission. Lord, we believe in that you have sent down, and we follow the Messenger. Inscribe us therefore with those who bear witness.' And they devised, and God devised, and God is the best of devisers. When God said, 'Jesus, I will take you to me and will raise you to Me, and I will purify you of those who do not believe. I will set your followers above the unbelievers till the Resurrection Day. Then unto Me shall you return, and I will decide between you, as to what you were at variance on. As for the unbelievers, I will punish them with a terrible punishment in this world and the next; they shall have no helpers.' (3:52-6)
As the above verses indicate, Jesus was raised to heaven before he died.
This means that according to the Qur'an he was not crucified. It was the plan of
the enemies of Jesus to put him to death on the cross, but God saved him and
somebody else was crucified. This plot and the false accusation of Mary are
considered by the Qur'an to be some of the sins of the non-believing Jews. All
this is clear in the following quotation:
And for their unbelief, and their uttering against Mary a mighty calumny, and for their saying, ‘We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the Messenger of God'... yet they did not slay him, neither crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who are at variance concerning him surely are in doubt regarding him, they have no knowledge of him, except the following of surmise; and they did not slay him of certainty... no indeed; God raised him up to Him; God is Almighty, All-wise. There is not one of the people of the Book but will assuredly believe in him before his death, and on the Resurrection Day he will be a witness against them. (4:156-9).
Who was the person crucified instead of Jesus? The Qur'an does not elaborate on this point nor does it give any answer to this question. The interpreters of the Qur'an have suggested a few names. But all these are individual guesses not supported by the Qur'an or the sayings of the Prophet Muhammad.
This means that Jesus will come back before the Day of Judgement. Again the Second Coming is not clearly mentioned in the Qur'an. However, the explain of the Qur'an understood the last verse of the above quotation: there is not one of the people of the Book but will assuredly believe in him before his death, and on the Resurrection Day he will be a witness against them, to mean that Jesus will come back and all the Christians and the Jews will believe in him before he dies. This understanding is supported by authentic sayings of the Prophet Muhammad.
After reading this presentation a believing Christian might say "This is what the Muslims, whom we always considered as heathens or infidels, say about Jesus." But the point of view which the Qur'an presents deserves serious consideration, to say the least, by those who are really concerned about God, faith and even Christianity itself for the following reasons:
- The Qur’an is the last version of God’s revelation and what it says is the ultimate truth. This might not mean much for those who do not believe in the Qur'an as such. However, the history of the Qur'an, modern textual criticism and scientific research of the content of this scripture leave no doubt about the truth it contains. The frequently made statements that the Qur'an is the word of Muhammad who copied his information from Jewish and Christian sources is made by people who do not know the history of the world, the Qur'an or Muhammad. The first Arabic translation of the Bible appeared two centuries after Muhammad's mission. If we add to this Muhammad's illiteracy and the scarcity of religious books in any language outside churches and temples in the sixth century we can understand the absurdity of this allegation.
- The oneness and universality of God's message requires that people accept all the messengers of God. Rejecting one of them amounts to rejecting them all. The Jews reject Jesus's mission and Muhammad's mission; the Christians reject Muhammad's mission; whereas the Muslims accept them all, but reject incorrect historical interpretations and human elements in these missions.
- Because of the Qur'an, Muslims love and respect Jesus as they love and respect the Prophet Muhammad. Moreover, the Qur'an reports some of Jesus's miracles which are not reported in the present gospel. For example, the Qur’an tells that Jesus spoke in the cradle and was able to tell people what they ate or treasured in their houses, to mention just a few.
- It is common knowledge that the divinity of Jesus was introduced by Saint Paul and his followers and was established on the dead bodies of millions of Christians through history which evoked the Castillo's well-known remark "To burn a man is not to prove a doctrine."
- The choice of the present four gospels was imposed in the conference of Nicea 325 C.E. under the auspices of the pagan Emperor Constantine for political purposes. Literally, hundreds of gospels and religious writings were considered apocrypha, i.e. books of doubtful authenticity. Some of those books were written by Jesus's disciples. If they were not more authentic than the four gospels they were of equal authenticity. Some of them still are available such as the Gospel of Barnabas and the Shepherd of Hermas which agree with the Qur’an.
- The Unitarian concept and the humanness of Jesus is not only held by Muslims but also by Jews and by some early groups of Christianity such as the Ebionites, the Cerinthians, the Basilidians, the Capocratians and the Hypisistarians to name several early sects. The Arians, Paulicians and Goths also accepted Jesus as a prophet of God. Even in the modern age there are churches in Asia, in Africa, the Unitarian church, and Jehova Witnesses who do not worship Jesus as God.
- Most serious studies of the Bible have shown that it contains a large portion of additions which neither Jesus nor the writers of the gospels said. The church, as Heinz Zahrnt said, "put words into the mouth of Jesus which he never spoke and attributed actions to him which he never performed." Those conclusions were arrived at by some members of the church. However, they are kept secret or available only to the specialists. One of those, who has shown that most of what the church says about Jesus is baseless is Rudolf Augustein in his book Jesus Son of Man,(published in Germany 1972 and translated into English 1977).
- The problem with present Christianity is the personality of Jesus which is completely misunderstood. Jesus' nature, mission and claimed death and resurrection, are all challenged by studies in the field. One of those is a book entitled The Myth of God Incarnate which appeared 1977 (edited by John Hick) and written by seven theologian scholars in England. Their conclusion is that Jesus was "a man approved by God, for special role within the divine purpose, and … the later conception of him as God incarnate … is a mythological or poetic way of expressing his significance for us." The best George Carey could say in his attempt to refute the findings of those theologians is that unless one takes Jesus as God Incarnate one won't be able to understand Jesus' mission or explain its impact on people. This definitely is a very weak argument because all great prophets such as Abraham, Moses, and Muhammad have had a tremendous impact on people and none of them claimed that he was God or a son of God.
- The concept of the Trinity is not, of course, available even in the present Bible. There are statements which negate it such as "The Lord our God is one Lord (Math. 12:29) and many others.
- It is worth noting that Jesus never claims divinity even in the present text of the Bible. The expression "Son of God" cannot be said to have come from Jesus himself. Hasting in The Dictionary of the Bible says "Whether Jesus used it of himself is doubtful." In my reading of the Bible, I found only two instances in John Chapter 5 and 11 where Jesus uses "son of God" to refer to himself. Other instances were used by others. Even those are very limited. However, even if the title "son of God" was used by Jesus himself one should remember the following points:
- As a biblical scholar said, "Semitic usage would never have allowed literal sense even though such an expression would be interpreted literally in the Hellenistic world of Jesus followers".
- The New Testament Greek words used for "son" are pias and paida, which means 'servant' or 'son in the sense of servant, are translated sonin reference to Jesus and servant in reference to others in some translations of the Bible (Mufassir, P. 15).
- The title "son of man" which is a self-designation of Jesus and occurs 81 times in the gospels is the clearest description and emphasis by Jesus on his humanity. The classical interpretation given to this title is that it is used to emphasize the human side of Jesus. Now the question which suggests itself is: Do contemporary Christians emphasize this aspect of Jesus?
by Ibrahim on 03 August 2013 - 21:08
THE POPE CONTRADICTS THE BIBLE
The traditional Biblical account of Jesus' crucifixion is that he was arrested and crucified by the orders and plans of the chief priest and Jewish elders. This account was denied in the 1960's by the highest Catholic Christian authority, the Pope. He issued a statement in which he said the Jews had nothing to do with Jesus' crucifixion. This definitely does contradict the Biblical account. You might say: This is a political decree. This agrees with what Muslims are saying: the church had introduced many elements into Christianity and was influenced by many factors which made its view of Christianity not only changeable but, by and large, contradict the early forms of Christianity.
The religious views concerning God, the Bible, and Man s relation to God which the church presented forced people into an unfortunate choice: either science or God. Most educated people have come to the conclusion that one can't be a scientist or an educated person and be a Christian. Thus many philosophers, scientists and the majority of the people lost hope of reconciling religion and science. This unfortunate understanding later on was generalized to include every religion as a result of the influence of western civilization, which was mainly Christian. This whole issue would not have rise in the first place if the teachings of Jesus were not distorted or tampered with. This is because, as Islam views the matter, there is no contradiction whatsoever between religion and science. Scientific facts are just one source of our knowledge of God. The other source is revelation as it is contained in the original teachings of Jesus and in the present text of the Qur’an. Both religion and true scientific knowledge are from the same source: God. So He won't contradict Himself.
Thus, concepts like the Trinity, The Son of God, Original Sin, the Atonement etc.. which were the product of distortion and miss-understanding in the history of Christianity drove people away not only from Christianity but also from other religions, including Islam, which is not affected by these problems. This is due to the fact that many people think that because Islam is a religion (the meaning of the very word is limited in western languages) it must be similar to Christianity. Very few people will have the interest and the ability to discover the falsehood of this assumption.
EVIDENCES FOR THE QUR'ANIC ACCOUNT
This implicit assumption is one of the causes of hesitation and unwillingness of many people to accept the Qur'anic view of Jesus. This is in spite of the fact that this point of view is supported by:
- The early history of Christianity which continued for three decades after Jesus’s disappearance as a sect within Judaism.
- The practice of many Christian sects and scholars throughout the history of Christianity.
- The findings of many Biblical scholars and scientific research which was applied to the Bible.
- The instinct of many people (some of whom think they are Christians) who believe in the One God, but can't accept Jesus as God or The Son of God.
It is worth noting that the main differences between the Qur'anic account and what modern research and scholars have found is that the Qur'an said what it says now about Jesus and his mission fourteen centuries ago and never changed its stand.
REASONS HOLDING PEOPLE FROM ISLAM
Some of the other reasons which might account for the rejection of the Qur'anic account include:
- The time-honored bias against Islam which was partly the product of the Crusades and partly the product of the Arab-Israeli conflict in the Middle East.
- Confusion. Many people although they do not accept Christianity, do not know where the truth is.
- Social Pressure and Academic Reputation. Many people were afraid to accept Islam because they felt they would be mocked, alienated from their relatives and peers if they openly rejected Christianity and accepted Islam. At the academic level, especially among orientalists, if one writes favorably about Islam and the Qur'an no body will review his work, quote from it or even consider it a scholarly work. He could be even destroyed professionally. The Washington Post (January 5, 1978) reported that a University of Richmond Professor, Dr. Robert Alley lost the chairmanship of the Department of Religion there because he holds the view that Jesus never claimed to be the son of God. After considerable research into newly found ancient documents, Dr. Alley concluded that:
The (Bible) passages where Jesus talks about the son of God are later additions..... what the church said about him. Such a claim of deity for himself would not have been consistent with his entire lifestyle as we can reconstruct. For the first three decades after Jesus' death Christianity continued as a sect within Judaism. The first three decades of its existence of the church were within the synagogue. That would have been beyond belief if they (the followers) had boldly proclaimed the deity of Jesus.
Despite these factors, and some others which I did not mention, there have been many people who have submitted to truth. The Islamic point of view about Jesus and other major issues strikes those who get introduced to it as something which makes a lot of sense and something which they hold implicitly without knowing it. This, and other characteristics made Islam the fastest growing religion in the world throughout history. It appeals even to faithful Christians because they discover that:
- Islam does not abolish Jesus, it rather puts him in the right position in the long line of men who brought real salvation to humanity. In reality they are adding a new dimension to their understanding of God, prophet-hood, and revelation.
- When Christianity and Judaism (or for that matter any religion) are looked at from the Islamic perspective they fit in neatly in the universal framework of the oneness of God and His plans for mankind. Moreover, one will understand clearly why there are some gaps or discrepancies in the Biblical account about certain issues.
- Islam does consider itself the final link in the long chain of revelation. It promises the followers of previous faiths great rewards if they add belief in Islam to their belief in their previous faith. The Prophet Muhammad said, "He who has believed in his religion then believed in what is revealed to me will be rewarded twice (by God)." That is once for believing in his faith and the other for recognizing truth and believing in Islam.
To sum up, Islam considers Jesus as one of God's great prophets. His mission was to preach the Oneness of God and to lead man to his Lord. He never claimed to be other than a servant and a Messenger of God. The Qur'anic account of his life and mission is supported by overwhelming evidence. The Muslims do believe in and are awaiting the Second Coming of Jesus. He will come back not as God to judge the non-Christians, but as Jesus, God's servant. His coming is to correct the misconception which people have developed about his personality and his mission. According to a saying of the Prophet Muhammad, he will stay for forty years which is going to be the happiest years of life on this earth. At that time everybody will believe in him as the messenger, not the Son of God. However, what about those who will not be able to live till his second coming? They better do it now!
by vk4gsd on 03 August 2013 - 22:08
i just saw pages of blurred words and then this just jumped out and struck me like lightning.
for this paragraph alone i am determined to read something of Islam's teachings.

by Two Moons on 04 August 2013 - 14:08
Where did these words come from?
by Ibrahim on 04 August 2013 - 14:08
Dr. Maneh Al-Johani, born in 1942 - 1363 Islamic calendar in a Town called (bali) between the two towns of Ais and AlOla . He is from Aljohaniya tribe and they descend historically from the area between Madinah AlMunaawarah and Yanbaa' in Saudi Arabia.
He traveled to Jordon with his father at the age of four and was there till about the age of fourteen. When he returned to Saudi Arabia and completed his studies in Althaqeef High School he graduated as one of the top students in Saudi Arabia.

Dr. Maneh ibn Hammad Al-Johani earned his BA in English from King Saud University, formerly known Riyadh University. And left for USA to continue his studies at Indiana University in Bloomington in the early seventies He served as president of the MSA at IU Bloomington and earned an MA in English literature and later on Dr Al-Johani received his Ph.D. in English and general linguistics and taught English at King Saud University, Riyadh between 1975-1995.He was Secretary General of the World Assembly of Muslim Youth, an independent International Muslim youth organization and a NGO associated with UNO.
. He was appointed a member of the Saudi Shoura Council in 1997 and was the Founding Trustee of the International Council for Islamic Information (ICII) UK launched in 1993 and was later elected Chairman of its Board of Trustees in 1996. He was Chairman, Board of Trustees Institute of Islamic Information and Education, Chicago, ILL. USA since 1990.

by Two Moons on 04 August 2013 - 14:08

by gouda on 04 August 2013 - 21:08
The Apoalypse [BOOK OF REV.} was written be the Apostle John at about 95_96 A.D.
is firmly substantiated by the testimony f Irenaeus 170 A.D. I renarus was the pupil
of Polycarp who in turn sat at the feet of John himself,and his words constitute extremely strong evidence.
Irenaeus wrote, John also the Lords Deciple says in the Apocalypse and then he quotes
Rev.1:12-16, 5;6 19:11-17 ALMOST WORD FOR WORDH.
He later quotes from REV. 17:12-14 and nearly every chapter in the book od Rev.
HJe declares the Apocacypse was seen by John towards the end of Domitians reign 81-96 A.d.
AGAINST HERESIES,1V, XX; V, XXXVI,XX.
THE TESTIMONY OF THE EARLY FATHERS CONFIRM IRENAEUS WORDS.,
AS DO THE WORDS OF THE BOOK OF REV. ITSELF.
I brahim says these things are not true ,because Mohammad came on the scene hundreds of years later and said they werent.
Gouda

by Two Moons on 04 August 2013 - 21:08
Gouda,
this debate is the fuel that has fed a fire for generations unchanged.
A meaningful debate has never taken place, no party was ever satisfied.
It is a sickness, a flaw in man.
Due respect to all but I do not take any of it literally, and do not worship Gods.
So it is irrelevant to me who thinks their version correct.
I was curious, especially about sources, as you know sources can always be questioned on any topic.
Based on one man's vision.
by vk4gsd on 04 August 2013 - 22:08
by beetree on 04 August 2013 - 22:08
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