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by Donald Deluxe on 03 June 2011 - 16:06
Amen, Mystere. I am related to one of the two soldiers who died on Concord Bridge on April 19, 1775 (and am a direct descendent of his relative the loudmouth Adjutant who shamed his fuddy-duddy superiors into confronting the British in the first place - you can read more about him at the link below). Another ancestor had part of his skull blown off at Antietam, and shook Abe Lincoln's hand in a military hospital when the Presidentg came to visit. My great-grandfather fought in Cuba during the Spanish-American War; after he returned and was mustered back into the Massachusetts Militia he was issued one of the earliest Smith & Wesson .38 Special revolvers that is still in the family and I have his dress sword.
Other family members have fought in other conflicts, some popular, some not, some advancing the cause of freedom for others and some not. The bottom line is that as you say, one doesn't need to have lived under a restrictive regime to have an appreciation of freedom, whether you fought for it yourself or, as in my case, ancestors did it for me.
http://www.newenglandtravelplanner.com/history/concord_fight.html
Other family members have fought in other conflicts, some popular, some not, some advancing the cause of freedom for others and some not. The bottom line is that as you say, one doesn't need to have lived under a restrictive regime to have an appreciation of freedom, whether you fought for it yourself or, as in my case, ancestors did it for me.
http://www.newenglandtravelplanner.com/history/concord_fight.html
by VomMarischal on 03 June 2011 - 16:06
Prager, Dipshit, the Great Ayn Rand is [sorry, WAS] a white supremacist. She edited the John Birch rag for most of her life. Yeah, you like freedom all right, but only for the people you SELECT.
You don't know a goddam thing. That's the problem...a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.
You don't know a goddam thing. That's the problem...a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.
by Ruger1 on 03 June 2011 - 17:06
Hans, thank you for the reply, but PLEASE consider these quotes....
Sue said...
All I am saying is please consider what the impact might be if she once more gains purchase on a message board, and develops a following. Could this kind of stuff be responsible for her getting her hands on dogs once more?
Donald said..
In exercising this right of association they are not opposed to free speech as you suggest, but rather are upset that you would permit a known, convicted animal abuser to remain, regardless of how much knowledge she might have, and have made a conscious decisions to avoid places where she is allowed to congregate.
SP said...
When you keep quiet and do not speak out you are condoning what that person did. Like a child molester, people need to speak out and if they do not then they are enabling that person to continue.
Slamdunc said...
I can not in good conscience go back on his foum and post. For me to go there would be enabling Janice and very hypocritical. I know you like Hans and that is great, I liked him too. But, I have my own morals and ethics and it disturbs me to much to participate in a forum that allows that.
by 4pack on 03 June 2011 - 18:06
I can't say more than Rugar did above.
by Prager on 03 June 2011 - 18:06
Ruger and Sue are only opposing views I can respect and consider, even so I sometimes/often do not agree with them, because they mean well and are not malicious.
I was thinking about what Sue said about Mengele and I have recoiled at the thought of that person.But let me tell you I believe that if we shut up people whom we do not like, or hate, we will never understand them and will not be able to defend ourselves against them. I do not by no means want to be associate of Mengele or Hitler or people like Janice for that matter, but I most definitely am interested in what they have to say. To only talk to people whom I like and agree with is debilitating and dangerous. I want to know what make people tick, all people good and bad. Don't you? For example it is very interesting that there are people like Janice who are intelligent and educated, but are also asocial and malicious and even so they are intelligent they do not see themselves as such. That to many may be an important lesson. We do always hear mothers saying about their children : He / She is so smart. However you never hear them to say their child has a good heart. Intelligence and evil may go together really well.
As far as me saying that: Just because someone is begotten on the back seat on 1957 Chevy does not make you more American then person who had to fight for it,... does not mean that I think that no American have fought for Freedom and for America.. What kind of person can suggest that I meant to say that?! Some people have incredible ability to twist and then put words in my mouth which I had no intention to say and have not say.
Here,
I have actually said this , but you have conveniently missed it: . ......... the rights which we enjoy and were fought for by many and many of whom died for them are actually part of her political system.
Thus off course I know that there are and have been Americans who fought for her and died for her, USA would not exist without them. I honor them, admire them and love them for it. They are what represents America to me. Do I have to actually spell this out for you?!? OMG!!!!
Donald Delux You have also not read what I am saying. I actually agree with you. Except I have never talked here about first amendment. I have never say that private speech can not be limited on private forums. I most definitely have said many times here that it can. And I agree with you on the thesis on association. Except I believe that let someone speak does not condone what that person is saying and it is not an association with such a person. Association would actually necessitates that I must agree with such person which I do not and I have said that many times. I most definitely do not associate and agree with people who have interest in abuse, but I do not see harm in letting them speak and to listen to them. Listening to people who are bad does not mean condoning it. There are shows on TV about Adolf Hitler and Charles Mason. Are you going to boycott these TV stations? I do not agree with feeding Purina, I think that it is an abuse, should I then ban these people from my forum?
Are you going to say that the TV channel is associating themselves with Charles Manson because they let him to say some of his devilish crap?
That would be silly right?
Prager Hans
I was thinking about what Sue said about Mengele and I have recoiled at the thought of that person.But let me tell you I believe that if we shut up people whom we do not like, or hate, we will never understand them and will not be able to defend ourselves against them. I do not by no means want to be associate of Mengele or Hitler or people like Janice for that matter, but I most definitely am interested in what they have to say. To only talk to people whom I like and agree with is debilitating and dangerous. I want to know what make people tick, all people good and bad. Don't you? For example it is very interesting that there are people like Janice who are intelligent and educated, but are also asocial and malicious and even so they are intelligent they do not see themselves as such. That to many may be an important lesson. We do always hear mothers saying about their children : He / She is so smart. However you never hear them to say their child has a good heart. Intelligence and evil may go together really well.
As far as me saying that: Just because someone is begotten on the back seat on 1957 Chevy does not make you more American then person who had to fight for it,... does not mean that I think that no American have fought for Freedom and for America.. What kind of person can suggest that I meant to say that?! Some people have incredible ability to twist and then put words in my mouth which I had no intention to say and have not say.
Here,
I have actually said this , but you have conveniently missed it: . ......... the rights which we enjoy and were fought for by many and many of whom died for them are actually part of her political system.
Thus off course I know that there are and have been Americans who fought for her and died for her, USA would not exist without them. I honor them, admire them and love them for it. They are what represents America to me. Do I have to actually spell this out for you?!? OMG!!!!
Donald Delux You have also not read what I am saying. I actually agree with you. Except I have never talked here about first amendment. I have never say that private speech can not be limited on private forums. I most definitely have said many times here that it can. And I agree with you on the thesis on association. Except I believe that let someone speak does not condone what that person is saying and it is not an association with such a person. Association would actually necessitates that I must agree with such person which I do not and I have said that many times. I most definitely do not associate and agree with people who have interest in abuse, but I do not see harm in letting them speak and to listen to them. Listening to people who are bad does not mean condoning it. There are shows on TV about Adolf Hitler and Charles Mason. Are you going to boycott these TV stations? I do not agree with feeding Purina, I think that it is an abuse, should I then ban these people from my forum?
Are you going to say that the TV channel is associating themselves with Charles Manson because they let him to say some of his devilish crap?
That would be silly right?
Prager Hans
by Prager on 03 June 2011 - 18:06
SP said...
When you keep quiet and do not speak out you are condoning what that person did. Like a child molester, people need to speak out and if they do not then they are enabling that person to continue.
How is that applicable to me? I will speak about what she did all day long. Again twisting of what i am saying.
Slamdunc said...
I can not in good conscience go back on his foum and post. For me to go there would be enabling Janice and very hypocritical. I know you like Hans and that is great, I liked him too. But, I have my own morals and ethics and it disturbs me to much to participate in a forum that allows that.
How is it immoral to let people speak? Speaking leads to understanding of people think. That is all. That does not mean that I would condone it.
Hans
When you keep quiet and do not speak out you are condoning what that person did. Like a child molester, people need to speak out and if they do not then they are enabling that person to continue.
How is that applicable to me? I will speak about what she did all day long. Again twisting of what i am saying.
Slamdunc said...
I can not in good conscience go back on his foum and post. For me to go there would be enabling Janice and very hypocritical. I know you like Hans and that is great, I liked him too. But, I have my own morals and ethics and it disturbs me to much to participate in a forum that allows that.
How is it immoral to let people speak? Speaking leads to understanding of people think. That is all. That does not mean that I would condone it.
Hans
by Sock Puppet on 03 June 2011 - 19:06
Hans,
Would you take someone who is an alcoholic out to the bar? Then why would you allow an abuser of GSD's to comment on your GSD forum? YOU ARE ENABLING HER SICKNESS. According to your point a known child molester should be allowed on a parenting site because they know how to control children. Pretty backwards thinking and honestly very laughable.
It has nothing to do with liking this person and more to do with keeping her from making new connections in the dog world..
You are enabling this persons sickness, if you can't see it then so be it. I still say keep her.
Would you take someone who is an alcoholic out to the bar? Then why would you allow an abuser of GSD's to comment on your GSD forum? YOU ARE ENABLING HER SICKNESS. According to your point a known child molester should be allowed on a parenting site because they know how to control children. Pretty backwards thinking and honestly very laughable.
It has nothing to do with liking this person and more to do with keeping her from making new connections in the dog world..
You are enabling this persons sickness, if you can't see it then so be it. I still say keep her.
by 4pack on 03 June 2011 - 20:06
Well thanks for not respecting my views Hans.
by ShadyLady on 03 June 2011 - 20:06
No Hans, but they aren't giving Charlie Manson a place on a forum to give advice and they sure aren't bringing in a satellite feed of him to do the news. You just don't get it.
by VomMarischal on 03 June 2011 - 21:06
LOL 4Pack. It's really kind of a pat on the back.
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