pennHip VS OFA - Page 2

Here is a different perspective (mine) on the topic: I prefer OFA certification to pennHIP because OFA COULD be done without anesthesia while pennHIP CANNOT be done without anesthesia.Some breeds are more susceptible to adverse effects of anesthesia (Rhodesian ridgebacks, anatolian shepherds for example) but I personally would like to avoid anesthesia for any dog whenever possible.Also, todate there are no head to head PROSPECTIVE comparison between pennHIP vs OFA showing one to be superior to the other in terms of predicting hip dysplasia. I have provided a link to an article below by Fred Lanting supporting pennHIP procedure for those interested.But I have my preferences for reasons mentioned above.Best wishes. http://www.workingdogs.com/doc0177.htm

For normal hip conformations, the reliability was 89.6% at 3-6 months, 93.8% at 7-12 months, and 95.2% at 13-18 months. These results suggest that preliminary evaluations of hip joint status in dogs are generally reliable. ..." If this information is accurate, I believe it supports OFA's ability to evaluate dogs at approximately 12 months of age with a 94.5% reliability. With the evaluation definitions OFA has in place a dog can recieve a borderline rating. Thus this same dog can be reevaluated at a later time. If the Germans can "a" stamp at 12 months why can't we? Kyle

Quoting Kyle: "For normal hip conformations, the reliability was 89.6% at 3-6 months, 93.8% at 7-12 months, and 95.2% at 13-18 months. These results suggest that preliminary evaluations of hip joint status in dogs are generally reliable. ..." Kyle, Does this mean that for a dog that has been rated normal, 89.6% of them turned out to be normal at 3-6 months and so on (which means 10% became dysplastic?) or the dogs age was 3-6 months when 89.6% of them were rated normal? In the case of the latter, was there any longitudinal follow up to confirm if these dogs did not develop dysplasia? And what was that duration? Please clarify. Thanks.

Sport Dog, please refer to the whole article. Here is the link again: http://www.offa.org/hipprelim.html Kyle, threoretically the OFA could properly certify at age one. However, since they also evaluate other breeds and some of them structurally mature way past their second birthday, I can only assume that they adopted a general guideline that will fit all breeds on the average. When you look at the OFA stats, it is interesting to know that some breeds have a very high incidence of HD, breeds that are similar in build and someare also very heavy in build. Also interesting to note is the German Pointer, two entries for the shorthair and the wirehair, though they are one breed, at least in Germany. The wirehair variety has about twice the incidence of HD. Before the OFA updated the stats pages a couple of years ago there were actually some breeds whose hips have gotten worse. Took some screenshots, should still have those in my old computer... One breed that made sense was the Dalmation - deafness, an issue at least as big if not bigger that had to be eliminated in that breed as well due to selective breeding. Goes back to my saying "the sum of all diseases will always remain the same in a population". You try to weed out one, and inadvertently due to other recessive combinations will bring another "flaw" to the surface. We should breed dogs, not hips. Overall healthy dogs that is. Especially until there is no fool proof HD testing method the whole dog is the most important factor to consider...

Sport Dog, I merely cut and pasted what DH had posted andcommented on same. The OFA offers a summary view on their experience with prelims. "... For normal hip conformations, the reliability was 89.6% at 3-6 months, 93.8% at 7-12 months, and 95.2% at 13-18 months. These results suggest that preliminary evaluations of hip joint status in dogs are generally reliable. ..." Link: http://www.offa.org/hipprelim.html I read this statement from the OFA to mean of the dogs pre screened at each respective age, when they were evaluated at 2 years, those that were given a normal hip confirmation at prescreen held at the percentage for 2 year evaluation.

DH I agree with breeding for the total dog. If the only answer is to breed dogs with good and excellent hips the HD issue should have been solved. How many GSD's have excellent hips but poor working ability and weak nerves. Yet they are bred and KKL. I have two males with borderline hips. Both have great nerve, high social aggression and natural full calm grips. We have decided not to breed them. I should add neither dog is suffering from symptoms of HD at 2.5 and 5 years. Both have interesting pedigrees as well. Kyle

I have done OFA xrays without anesthesia (sometimes, I give the frisky ones a little acepromazine IM) for as long as the OFA has been in existence (nearly 40 years). My first GSD was OFA GS-5. My dogs consistently OFA "normal" or "excellent"--plus their "a" stamps are "a" normal (never fast or NZ). This is my routine: hip/elbow prelims (never bothered to send to OFA) at 6 months, "a" stamp hips at ~ 12 months, OFA hips/elbows at 24 months or later. I agree with Sport Dog about avoiding the risk of using general anesthesia. However, dogs of my breeding (sold to clients whose vets insist on using anesthesia) also OFA "good" or "excellent" WITH the use of anesthesia. Even the Vet Med Teaching Hospital at UC Davis does their OFA xrays using a small amount of dilute IV acepromazine.

Louise, That happened to me. We took a 12 month old female in for pre-lims and the vet put her under. She came out of it almost. We got her home and she died (peacefully) but very upsetting to me) next to my bed that evening. She was healthy in every way but just couldn't tolerate the anesthesia. I won't allow them to ever be put under for hip evals again. Happy Holidays to Everyone! Birdy...

I actually plan to do both but I have heard that an bad x-ray tech can make good hips look bad and a good tech can make bad hips look good. Is this true? I was also told that it is best to have the dog under anesthesia to get a better result. Is this true as well?

SE Angel, Personally, I don't think you need to do both.If you read the postings above and the articles linked therein, you will understand the pros and cons of each mehtod and make an informed decision for your self.I personally would like to avoid unnecessary anesthesia.It is absolutely NOT a prerequisite for a good quality film. The way these radiographs (Xrays) are analyzed is by looking at the extent of contact between the acetabular lip of the hip bone and the femoral head.This is done taking into account the position of the animal and the angle in which the film is shot.All of these are standardized for any given procedure (OFA, pennHIP etc.,).An experienced radiologist will take all this into account and so a technician cannot cheat on this.The vet will re-shoot the film if the preliminary look does not satisfy him/her. I hope you take the time to read both sides of the story and make a decision that fancy you.I hope this info was useful.Best wishes.