NEWBIE - Page 5

I enjoyed reading post as well, and I hope the OP understands the complexity of his task at hand.

AZSHEP-I don't understand the need to ask any of the above questions after finding out his dog has a crap pedigree. And I would absolutely handle it the same way in person.  If you notice, a lot of people did start out being nuetral until it was obvious he had no clue and was convinced he did.

If the first generation of Bad Boll had asked a group of reputable breeders a question of this nature I'm sure they would have gotten much the same response.

I'm not real impressed that he came here looking for advice simply because he didn't take any of it. What's impressive about that? Likewise, it doesn't seem too impressive that he says he wants to improve the breed in his area since he plans to do it with one crap dog and one cheap dog (which he expects this board to direct him to).

What could the board do better in this case? Tell him where to find the dog he wants? Because that is the ONLY thing this guy would be willing to listen to. Nah, he's not looking for advice or mentoring. He's looking for a shortcut to breederville. And he is certainly misguided if this is how he expects to do it.

Just because the cult of the amatuer has always existed it doesn't mean conscientious people have to condone it. Personally I will do all I can to fight it. If some one wants to endanger lives don't involve helpless beings. Go skydiving, play Russian roulette, just leave the damn dogs out of it. And pigs as well, for that matter.

I'm not a breeder either, just sick of seeing little lives (dogs, babies, horses) being haphazardly brought into this world without responsible commitment toward the outcome. In a toss up between the innocent and the ignorant-guess where my loyalties are going to lie? There is nothing in this world that is going to convince this guy what he is doing is unethical. No matter how nicely it's said.

Pedigree does not make the dog. What happened to Health, Temperment, Structure? What is a crappy pedigree, one that does not have VA's running thru it, high V's or an V's, no sch? I agree if he is going to breed the male, he needs to do his research and if he could locate a breeder to mentor him all the better. I

think we would be better served telling him before he breeds to have his male checked for HIPS, Elbows, Hemo (sp), and the list goes on with genetic carriers. I am sure someone on this board could give a fuller list than I can think of right now. We have alot of dogs with GREAT pedigrees and they produce hips, elbow, etc.

I do think if people were educated about how they could possibly breed a healthy litter and they need to be prepared to keep that litter if not sold and the cost of breeding a healthy litter, the REAL COSTS. You might slow alot of them down or at least get them to think twice about what they are doing or at the very least understand what they are really getting into. It sounds great to have 2 dogs mate, 5 puppies and sell them for $1,000.00 a a pup. So ok, we have $5,000.00 in Profit to the novice. So who can now bring that number to reality?

I'm not going to simply walk away from this...I've heard some great advice that has been taken to heart.  If my male turns out to not have what it takes, then yes, he'll simply be my family's great pet.  When it's all said and done, I might not ever be able to use him for breeding purposes, if that's the case then fine, I'll find another young male or pup.  I just went back through and read through every post and I think there was some misunderstanding.  I'm not looking for a titled bitch with a great pedigree for $1,000-$2,500. Perhaps it came across that way and if so, i apologize.  I'm looking for a pup with good bloodlines that has potential.  Thanks a again for all the comments and advice.

emttgt06,I'm not going to simply walk away from this.

I understood this, that is why, I honestly feel getting good advice on health, genetics, temperment and the real costs asscociated with becoming a breeder would better serve you. There is a wealth of information on this board with lots of people willing to share. I am not trying to discourge or incourage you, just get you educated so that if you do breed, the pups have a fighting chance.

Also take to heart, you will find a lot of information on this board on selling the pups to quaified homes, and what happens to them if just sold to anyone who has the bucks. This is a whole other issue you need to research.

I was also very serious about being prepared to keep the litter if not sold, not to long ago, a gal asked for help here because she could not get 5 (I think it was 5) pups sold. She did not understand why they were not selling, pedigree was there. This happens more than we care to admit. So now you have a litter that needs social skills, vet care and all the things that make the pup into a good dog. YOU NEED TO BE AWARE so you can do the right thing by the litter you have chosen to have.

All About Dawgs,

I have yet to read a post condoning the breeding you describe.  But to your point, if the first generation of Bad Boll breeders did get the same response as Newbie, then clearly they decided to continue their endeavor of breeding.

That is my point.  If the guy is going to breed then he will do it with good information or no information.  This board is a one of kind wealth of information and education.  My view is let's continue that level as opposed to other options.

As far as Newbie taking the advice on the board....how the heck do you know which posts he will lean towards and which ones he will ignore. 

For all you know he bought 6 potbellied pigs in the past 36 hours and is breeding them to a V rated female rescued from a shelter in order to fund a quick trip to visit you, in order to learn more about what the appropriate qualifications are for breeding german shepherds in the United States. 

Or maybe he ended up ignoring some very VALID points because the tone of the message was pretentious and condescending. 

AZSHEP6

Wonderingif

AZSHEP6

Wondering if i could get your email addy, had a question for you and couldn't seem to find it.

b.kimery@yahoo.com

Another thing you need to look into, does your state have a puppy lemon law, if so from any proceeds you receive you need to put aside funds to rebate back to buyers when the vet states it is "genetic". Plus when the buyer does not listen to your advice and takes thier cutie pie to the doggie park so they acn play with all of the other cutie pies, but has not had the time to get the final shots, or got them and did not wait long enough and the pup gets parvo, and they balme the breeder.

Or a prospective buyer comes to look at the pups, and was just at another kennel and did not tell you, and they bring the parvo virus to you and you whole litter is now very ill.

Have you been around a bitch that is delivering her pups, do you have a vet close by in case she needs a c-section, do you know how to help a pup survive that is not breathing or taking moms milk or what about a bitch that is not a good Mom.

Again, I am not discouraging you, I am giving you facts that need to be addressed prior to the litter on the ground.

I understand you are going to do this, be it your current male or a new one. Find a breeder that can help you and mentor, If you do not have one close, by phone, by email. Just someone who can give you the help and education.

It is like driving a car for the first time, it is harder than it looks. Drivers education requires classroom training along with behind the wheel. By the way Kudos to you for trying to get educated.