Looking for Hodie(An old member here i learnt few important things from) - Page 4

Hundmutter, it's hard to understand until you're really in it. Gustav made a great point...the amount of crap that goes on in the dog world is amazing. You really do have a hard time trusting anyone. Breeders are probably the worst at it, we all believe our dogs are the best and will do anything to prove that. No matter how often someone says they don't care about recognition, you know they do. Everyone wants to be recognized for their work and even greater for their passion. You'll never convince me that someone who dedicates their life to dogs, and in particular GSDs, doesn't want to achieve or accomplish something that gains them wide spread notoriety. It's just human nature to want to be "the best." Breeders want to breed the next sieger or national champion. Many don't have the ability themselves to train that high level of a dog, so they try to diminish the importance of the handler in the equation, or when they can't even sniff a high level working home for their puppies, they diminish the value of high level competition or bash sport all together. Over my time in the breed, I've noticed that once a breeder starts slamming IPO for what it's become, it's a very short time until they breed their first untitled dog. I'm sure most will have some good reasons for it, first and foremost being "I've done it, I know the dog can do it," but the truth is, they probably barely passed club trials the first few times they titled dogs, and knowing that no one is going to take the time to look up their scores in the magazines, live in the reality that they have created for themselves.

Plain and simple there is a huge divide between breeders/high level competitors and the regular pet owner/customer out there. Most of it comes due to the perceived higher knowledge that people "in the game" have and how hard they're all working to keep that divide. Many of us had to go through a lot of "you don't know anything" in real life for a very long time until we finally "knew something." And so now most of us feel we need to treat others the very same way. Basically, we've been hazed, so now we get to do it to everyone else. That divide is also profitable for everyone actually involved in the dog business, so it’s smart for most people to perpetuate and defend it as much as they can. Unfortunately the ”mentor/mentee” process that everyone wants you to go through before you have any say about anything dog just perpetuates this as well. Too much in the dog world is “just because I said so and I’m so and so” rather than actually giving a real explanation…this is usually because people don’t have real explanation and have just been repeating what has been told to them prior which just continues the cycle.

And just to add...its not that I believe Hodie thought of herself as royalty, or even wanted to be treated that way. It's the people surrounding/supporting those types of people that really make the "royal" environment. They're the ones that step in when they're not even part of a discussion to defend someone's honor and not add to the discussion but just try to prove to someone that the person they're speaking with is too far above them to even have a discussion with.

Bav: " I mean...Germany still makes their breed wardens and judges title their breeding stock, but these special folk on the internet know way more than anyone like that so they don't have to follow the rules they try to make everyone else follow."

Not going to get involved into the discussion, but I LOVE this statement...

Hodie deserved a crown if any one does, just for sharing her expertise with the mostly medical stuff which in my memory, she did with so many posters from disadvantaged countries when it came to vet care. I am sure it was that type of compassion and willingness to help that NigerDelta Mann wishes he could tap into, again. I don't care if it was only from a book. I doubt that was the case, as her intellect was not limited to GSDs. In the end the respect from the people in need was always the same: Gratefulness for her help.

When she fell on hard times, and let us know about her bad knees, I bought one of her prized possessions---a very special book that I will never be able to read because it is in German. I was hoping to help her in a way that would also honor her pride. I hope she is well, I wish her the best. I still think of her as a friend.

I think you are a very good person beetree and expect you to be the same in hard times, some do change though in difficult times

I see what you are saying BW, really I do. Particularly the bit
about "We've been hazed, so now we get to do it to everyone
else." There is a good deal of research on school bullying that
bears that one out, I understand ! But I'd kinda hope adults
using a hobby / business forum could rise above that ongoing,
tit-for-tat childishness.
Maybe not.

As to the "state of the dog world", well you and Gustav live in the
US and so maybe you are correct about the whole 'dog scene'
there, but can you appreciate things are not always quite the same
the whole world over ? ( I'm sure Gustav can.) I don't want to re-run
that conversation with Beetree some months ago, about just how
UNhelpful members of the GSD community in the States are to each
other, as compared to those in the UK. However: its funny, despite
that "I'm all right Jack" attitude seeming so prevalent when it comes
to breeding loan terms & puppy sales contracts, I have actually seen
quite a bit of caring concern and help for others exhibited by people
on PDB to each other and each others' dogs in times of stress.
Go figure.

Yeah sure there are rude and selfish Brits in our dog circles too, but it
really isn't anything like your description, and that majority is what I am
used to & have always operated within, so it gives me a different perspective,
I suppose. Instead of "Oh good they have come a cropper / been caught in a
hypocrisy - let's kick 'em while they are down", the attitude is more likely to be
"What can we do to help them ?" or just "Well they made their own bed,
ignore them and let them lie in it".

Oh, and you can't be convinced anyone exists who does not want to achieve
notoriety / be the 'best' ? I think that might be down to the stereotypical
American image too. Sometimes I think you guys revel in that image, at the
same time as denying it when teased about it ! You can choose not to believe
me, but I have never desired to do 'the best' with my own Shepherds, or those
of my late mentor. I don't think she seriously harboured any great desire to be
'top' with her kennel, either. What we both had in common is that we knew
things like money and time and premises have a big effect on how far you can
get, just as much as the bloodlines you use, or how lucky you get with your
stock on health issues, and so on. We Brits are maybe a wee bit more practical
about our ambitions, we have not swallowed "the American Dream" perhaps ?

Yeah, hund, gotta watch out 'swallowing' that "american dream'....it could just gag you if you're not prepared to work for it.

Oh Joan, Joan, Joan - I do not (of course) mean that if I worked
Veda in an Ob. competition, I didn't hope we'd win - or at least
Place - and we strove to produce good healthy specimens of the
breed with the Showdogs, of course we did. But that isn't the same
as swallowing whole an idea that we have to strive to overcome ALL

odds to be - (and therefore will BECOME) - THE top dog / kennel /

competitor,  and bugger who we had to tread on to make the climb up !

I was prepared to WORK at the Obedience; and would have done so

with an IPO prospect puppy IF I'd been in the right places and times and

had the right finances to entertain such ambitions. But I wasn't. And I can accept that, ...
usually without lashing out with insults to someone who disagrees with
me about anything, on this forum or elsewhere (as you, for one, full know).
And I sure as hell don't think like : "Well I've got to be nasty to so & so,
because they are doing better out of life / with their dogs than I am".

Are there not an awful lot of people in the States who aren't doing too

well under that idea that everyone can achieve anything, as long as

they work hard for it ?    [What was that about "Land of the Free ...

and Home of the (wage)Slave. "]

 

Wow. I wasn't aware of lashing out because others are doing better with their dogs thingy. But I am too well aware of the lashing out by those who stereotype and want to impose their likes on others. Personally, I don't care what others do as long as their dogs don't suffer for the sake of ego.
But, really, the american dream has nothing to do with standings in the breed...but is the desire to be allowed to work and earn a living and provide a home for family, better than what the immigrant parents had.
BTW, it's Land of the free and home of the Brave. ( free and slave are contradiction in terms) I've worked very hard all my life and have achieved my goals. Never been on the gov dole or charity. As for 'achieve anything '...one must be realistic in what 'any thing' is. Some people like to bitch and complain and want hand outs. Our current pres achieved his goal against all odds.

Only the Brits could get their panties all tied up in a knot because someone... from Canada, no less, lol, used the word, "royalty" to make a point! Too funny! :)

Forgive me Hundmutter if I don't take your word for the last one on the superiority of intent relating to UK dog breeders' competitiveness on the whole, vs. USA. I need a bigger statistical field in all fairness than who posted a few months back. :)


Hodie isn't coming back by the looks of it, thanks to DenWolf's reporting of her in person stop, to check on her. Hodie's choice at this point...seeing as GSD has made it clear where he stands.

Don't have a go at me, girls - Bavarian Wagon was the one
explaining to me, as an outsider, 'how it is' in the US dog
fancy. Apparently justifying the behaviour of "ganging up"
on posters (like Hodie).

I'm just commenting on a cultural difference !

Speaking of which, Sunny's use of "royalty" ain't so strange;
last I heard, Canada was still in the Commonwealth, and
acknowledged Brenda as Queen.

BTW Bee, please note that I wrote the reference to the
kindnesses I've seen between US posters BEFORE I saw
your reference to Hodie's knees  (we were posting at the

same time).

& Joan, I have never doubted that (although you don't cry
about it) your life must have been really hard at times. I respect
your decades of work with animals. We may not see eye2eye
in all matters political, but you do have my admiration, and I'd
certainly not want to 'tear you down' in the way Bav.Wagon
describes (wherever I lived !).

"Home of the Brave" LOL, too funny; I live in England, not on
Pluto ...

 

Nighty-night !      Zzzzzzzzzz...