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by LanesShepherds on 01 August 2010 - 22:08
OK, I have got this check out the difference in the AKC Champs from 1940-2003
Now if you want to see the different types of German Shepherds
Old Fashion Large German Shepherd Dogs are the kind I breed. Dogs exceeding 30" at the withers, and well over 100 pounds in weight.This is my choice I breed what I like and I feel the standard is for show people because as you will see they change the standard when ever they like.
Look at it this way if Captain Max von Stephanitz didn't change things up based on the dogs that was there at the time there would not have ever been a German Shepherd Dog. So to each his own people who like what I like and those who like something different fine. Live and let live who am I to tell you what you should like or what breed of dog to own.
For the people who love to yell about the standard take a look here What does the standard mean
Now if you want to see the different types of German Shepherds
Old Fashion Large German Shepherd Dogs are the kind I breed. Dogs exceeding 30" at the withers, and well over 100 pounds in weight.This is my choice I breed what I like and I feel the standard is for show people because as you will see they change the standard when ever they like.
Look at it this way if Captain Max von Stephanitz didn't change things up based on the dogs that was there at the time there would not have ever been a German Shepherd Dog. So to each his own people who like what I like and those who like something different fine. Live and let live who am I to tell you what you should like or what breed of dog to own.
For the people who love to yell about the standard take a look here What does the standard mean
by Slamdunc on 01 August 2010 - 22:08
Isn't that special.
by Diane Jessup on 01 August 2010 - 22:08
As long as there are purebred dogs, there will be folks who breed what pleases them.
A standard should NOT be changed, and to do so is considered very serious. This is because everyone knows that dog breeds go though FADS and it would be very harmful for a breed to have the standard changed to fit each fad.
There will be a "market" for variations from the "standard type" of each breed. This is because there is a new crop of "newbies" coming along all the time. ANd newbies tend to think "bigger is better" in almost ANY breed, or that one color is "rare" or that a different type of coat is "rare", etc.
As long as you health test your breeding animals, are set up to keep any pups you are unable to sell, represent your animals HONESTLY, microchip your pups so when they end up (if they do,not saying they will) in a shelter or something, you can be responsible for them, well, then I personally don't see the problem. : )
I have the exact same issue in my breed,the American pit bull. The "real" American pit bull, as bred for well over 4 centuries in pureform, is a medium dog, athletic, not overdone, and not weighing over 65 pounds. Today you see MORE ads for "100 pound" and "rare blue" dogs CALLED pit bulls than for real pit bulls. There is a market with newbies for these animals, but they are certainly not American pit bulls, and would be of NO interest to any serious student of the breed.
100 pound "pit bulls" and 100 + pound "german shepherds" are NOT representative of the "medium working dog" which both standards describe... If you feel your oversized animals have some merit not found in "real" GSD, then let your buyers know that, but you should also be honest about what they CANNOT do because they don't meet the standard.
Fair enough?
A standard should NOT be changed, and to do so is considered very serious. This is because everyone knows that dog breeds go though FADS and it would be very harmful for a breed to have the standard changed to fit each fad.
There will be a "market" for variations from the "standard type" of each breed. This is because there is a new crop of "newbies" coming along all the time. ANd newbies tend to think "bigger is better" in almost ANY breed, or that one color is "rare" or that a different type of coat is "rare", etc.
As long as you health test your breeding animals, are set up to keep any pups you are unable to sell, represent your animals HONESTLY, microchip your pups so when they end up (if they do,not saying they will) in a shelter or something, you can be responsible for them, well, then I personally don't see the problem. : )
I have the exact same issue in my breed,the American pit bull. The "real" American pit bull, as bred for well over 4 centuries in pureform, is a medium dog, athletic, not overdone, and not weighing over 65 pounds. Today you see MORE ads for "100 pound" and "rare blue" dogs CALLED pit bulls than for real pit bulls. There is a market with newbies for these animals, but they are certainly not American pit bulls, and would be of NO interest to any serious student of the breed.
100 pound "pit bulls" and 100 + pound "german shepherds" are NOT representative of the "medium working dog" which both standards describe... If you feel your oversized animals have some merit not found in "real" GSD, then let your buyers know that, but you should also be honest about what they CANNOT do because they don't meet the standard.
Fair enough?
by shostring on 01 August 2010 - 22:08
very interesting I enjoyed reading these pages thanks
by Kimmelot on 01 August 2010 - 23:08
"100 pound "pit bulls" and 100 + pound "German shepherds" are NOT representative of the "medium working dog" which both standards describe... If you feel your oversizes animals have some merit not found in "real" GSD, then let your buyers know that, but you should also be honest about what they CANNOT do because they don't meet the standard."- Dianne
If a breeder is not claiming to be producing what others are ( real GSDs as you say) , then what about the 99% of GSD breeders that are putting "spun ducky woo woo's" into homes as "pets" ( as the poor dog cant slow down to eat, or can't focus on the non-pack leader). The door swings both ways on this subject.There are working puppies born every day to excellent breeders, and there kin, that are placed into pet homes that are unaware and unprepaired to deal with the issues of having a high energy and dominate dog. Lane's dogs are pets first, loyal , large, impressive, stable minded pets. Because they are still German Shepherd dogs they still have the intelligence to want to please, they are calmer and can be used for therapy dogs. Creating a dog that still has a function, even if its not your goal, does not make it any less the breed it is geneticaly born to. ( not saying that was what you where saying, just throwing my 2c in)
Whisper
If a breeder is not claiming to be producing what others are ( real GSDs as you say) , then what about the 99% of GSD breeders that are putting "spun ducky woo woo's" into homes as "pets" ( as the poor dog cant slow down to eat, or can't focus on the non-pack leader). The door swings both ways on this subject.There are working puppies born every day to excellent breeders, and there kin, that are placed into pet homes that are unaware and unprepaired to deal with the issues of having a high energy and dominate dog. Lane's dogs are pets first, loyal , large, impressive, stable minded pets. Because they are still German Shepherd dogs they still have the intelligence to want to please, they are calmer and can be used for therapy dogs. Creating a dog that still has a function, even if its not your goal, does not make it any less the breed it is geneticaly born to. ( not saying that was what you where saying, just throwing my 2c in)
Whisper
by LanesShepherds on 02 August 2010 - 00:08
Diane,
If you looked at the link's I posted you would have seen that the dogs from 1940-1970 looked very different than than the dogs from 1970 on.
That tells you that the standard has been changed I am not making anyone buy my dogs they are for me and people who like what I like if you like something else that's up to you.
As a family pet there is nothing they can't do one thing they do real well is when people see them they cross to the other side of the street and when they bark the windows rattle and you almost have to beg people to come into your house so I guess that makes them great home protecters and they didn't have to bite anyone.
German Shepherds Dogs & puppies that are Intelligent, Noble, Dignified, Sensitive, Loyal. Sound in mind and body.
See I don't judge, what I like is what I like and I careless what anyone thinks or feels about it. To each his own.
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If you looked at the link's I posted you would have seen that the dogs from 1940-1970 looked very different than than the dogs from 1970 on.
That tells you that the standard has been changed I am not making anyone buy my dogs they are for me and people who like what I like if you like something else that's up to you.
As a family pet there is nothing they can't do one thing they do real well is when people see them they cross to the other side of the street and when they bark the windows rattle and you almost have to beg people to come into your house so I guess that makes them great home protecters and they didn't have to bite anyone.
German Shepherds Dogs & puppies that are Intelligent, Noble, Dignified, Sensitive, Loyal. Sound in mind and body.
See I don't judge, what I like is what I like and I careless what anyone thinks or feels about it. To each his own.
by Sunsilver on 02 August 2010 - 01:08
If you looked at the link's I posted you would have seen that the dogs from 1940-1970 looked very different than than the dogs from 1970 on.
That's very true, but the standard was NEVER 100 lbs and 26 plus inches! That is a total fallacy.
Yes, there have always been ovesized GSDs and some people prefer them, and I personally will not fault them for that. (I have a Shiloh shepherd, so I have no right to complain about oversized dogs....
) But to claim such oversized dogs were ever the standard is totally WRONG!
That's very true, but the standard was NEVER 100 lbs and 26 plus inches! That is a total fallacy.
Yes, there have always been ovesized GSDs and some people prefer them, and I personally will not fault them for that. (I have a Shiloh shepherd, so I have no right to complain about oversized dogs....
) But to claim such oversized dogs were ever the standard is totally WRONG!
by VonIsengard on 02 August 2010 - 01:08
Really.
Was this old fashioned GSD 30' 100+ lbs? www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/1208.html
How about this guy? A personal favorite of mine. www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/141.html
Or www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/1629.html ?
If you want to breed giant couch potato style "GSD"s that's your prerogative, but don't claim them as "old fashioned" and please don't quote Stephanitz to serious breed people. The standard hasn't changed, all that has changed is market trends of selling GSDs for $$$. And here in the USA we like our labs, goldens, rotts and GSDs to be double what they should be, bigger is better, right?
Was this old fashioned GSD 30' 100+ lbs? www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/1208.html
How about this guy? A personal favorite of mine. www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/141.html
Or www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/1629.html ?
If you want to breed giant couch potato style "GSD"s that's your prerogative, but don't claim them as "old fashioned" and please don't quote Stephanitz to serious breed people. The standard hasn't changed, all that has changed is market trends of selling GSDs for $$$. And here in the USA we like our labs, goldens, rotts and GSDs to be double what they should be, bigger is better, right?
by LanesShepherds on 02 August 2010 - 02:08
Where did I or anyone else say that 100 lbs was the standard and who said anything was better than any other are you people
just adding your own words and pretending someone else said them because I have read the post and none of what you state was ever mention.
just adding your own words and pretending someone else said them because I have read the post and none of what you state was ever mention.
by deacon on 02 August 2010 - 02:08
As most of my PSD's are donated, I don't care size or weight as long as they can hunt and engage a man if necessary!!
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