No more pointy ears for tsa - Page 17

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by joanro on 04 January 2019 - 22:01

Susie, I'm with you...don't let such obviously unstable and neurotic people on the plane. *They* are the danger.. to every one else!

Hund, nobody is LOOKING for dangerous LOOKING people! The dogs are there to IDENTIFY anyone carrying things like explosives...that is their job, to identify the truely dangerous people!! With their nose! Not their ears!

Your unstable people out themselves, hund, when they go berserk and cause mass histeria...those should be taken out of the airport, never to board a commercial airliner!

by ValK on 05 January 2019 - 03:01

Hundmutter
I think Val probably got what I was trying to portray

sure, i do understand. but i don't think any of those poor sods of customs & immigration officers did have any say before final decision was handed down from top management.

by GSCat on 05 January 2019 - 06:01

Susie-

In answer to your question about why people fear dogs, I was afraid of dogs for a long time after I was bitten by a police K9 as a kid. At the time I didn't notice what shape the ears were, but I sure noticed the pointy TEETH!

btw, it wasn't the dog or handler's fault...

Hundmutter

by Hundmutter on 05 January 2019 - 10:01

Quite a lot of people are pathologically fearful of either all dogs, or some dogs (may be about breed /ears; may be just about size); without even having the excuse of having ever been bitten. I have never been in a fire, but I am almost paralysingly scared of being burned by flames ( yet I can just about 'take' being scalded by liquids); not to the point of hysteria, but close. And some people are that bad, or worse, about whatever it is they are scared of. That's how phobias work. Not everyone has access to hypnotherapy or other 'cures'.

Joan confirms what I said to Susie. That you cannot always tell by looking. If someone acts 'crazy', you (or the port's controlling authority) might feel justified in not letting them on board the plane or other vehicle, or through a border. But I (and I'm not alone) see it that not everybody who acts 'crazy' is going to be any threat to life and limb; and many, many quite 'uncrazy', 'normal' looking people can be as mad as(Edited by Western Rider Hund you know and have been warned about using vulgar language) underneath their exterior. It is exactly right that we rely on the detection by the K9s noses; and that for OUR purposes, and the fact that there is little difference between breeds' olfactory abilities, it is not necessary that the dog in the moment be a prick eared one.

Ears do not make a real difference to someone in an explosive vest. So where then would be the harm in using dogs in circumstances where a lot of other, non-bombing, non-crazy people including children and the elderly and the phobic are part of the equation ? I might believe that is an unnecessary 'point' to stick on; Joan clearly does not.

As I told Susie, you cannot 'tell' someone they are wrong and hope to convince them. That works both ways. I cannot convince Joan; she cannot change my belief.

Unless of course one just likes the thought of bullying people because those people are not 'like you', then we have a whole different reasoning to hang onto in arguing our side of the debate.

 

ValK, I am not party to whether there were any such discusions, of course, so you may be right.  However, this may not be any worse a phenomenon than the regular lack of communications between management & workers !  I can only go by what I'm hearing from Police Handlers here, about the abilities of their drop-eared dogs; so unless those many individuals are all being drugged and gagged to toe some party line on the issue, I'll continue to believe the actual handlers do have an input, and are satisfied in the training and performance of their UK dogs. And without a lack of effectiveness, there is no reason for them to object to those dogs being less fearfully regarded by the public.


by joanro on 05 January 2019 - 14:01

Hund, psychotic people you describe are a danger to every one on board a plane because of irrational behavior....they do not belong on a plane they belong locked up in an asylum.
You are taking things to an extreme comparing fear of dogs with fear of fire. Anyone who is as fearful of fire as you are better stay out of public places that use a fireplace....you might cause mass civil disobedience with your hysteria over seeing flamesin the fireplace.

But when we had forest fires around us a few years ago, you better believe I had a fear of those fires getting to this side of the mountain...but that is a rational fear, and not irrational fear you describe that you have.
Psychotic people don't belong on an airliner...they are a danger to every one on board.

by joanro on 05 January 2019 - 14:01

Hund, reading your posts leads me to believe you have been indoctrinated in the ideology that right is wrong, wrong is right...up is down, down is up. If so, then we will never see eye to eye. Two different perspectives of the world and therefore our realities are on different planes.
I prefer the open eyes, no rose glasses and understanding there is a difference between people who live on different continents....that's why everyone should live in the world that matches their reality.
China for the Chinese, Japan for the Japanese, Australia for Australians, Europe for Europeans, etc.
Hundmutter

by Hundmutter on 05 January 2019 - 15:01

So you supported Apartheid in South Africa, back in the day ?

by joanro on 05 January 2019 - 15:01

No, hund, I did not say a damn word about racism. Aparthied would fall under wrong is right.

Are you, then, in support of confiscation of farmers' land without compensation? When there was no such thing as farms in sa before the farmers created them, and created the country for that matter, which fed the country? That, too, falls under wrong is right.

by duke1965 on 05 January 2019 - 16:01

hund, are you losing it, really what is wrong with you
Jessejones

by Jessejones on 05 January 2019 - 17:01

And America for Native Americans.

Come on folks. The world is changing, and will never stop changing. It is the only thing that is constant.
Certain peoples that have been majority In some counties, are becoming minorities quickly. It‘s happening, nothing can be done. Basta.

Getting back to dogs...

I‘ll guarantee you that if a pointy-ear dog finds someone or their child in a pile of rubble after a bomb or an earthquake...or a pointed eared dog pulls that someone or their kid out of an avalanche while on a ski trip....seeing those pointy ears come through the rubble or snow will be the most beautiful sight in the WHOLE WORLD. You are going to love pointy eared dogs and all dogs forever.

I travel a lot. I never go through the full body scanner. I don‘t trust them. I always get a pat down instead. Since more dogs are working detection, and faster and better and a lot safer than the medically dubious full body scanners, that alone should be reason enough for folks to accept any dogs walking past you or your kids for a quick sniff. Usually when dogs are used in the lines, the body scanners are not used. 

Maybe some public relations, public announcements, posters, with more friendly looking GSDs and Mals would help a bit at Airports. On a side note, I do cringe sometimes at all the pics folks post, taken in a split second in time, when their dog rips open his mouth to portray a super aggressive looking, all teeth, GSD. To me anyway, that is not the heart and soul of the breed. It is misleading to the public.


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