Bitework Question: How should trainer progress. - Page 2

@ BW...Below is a pup 6 mos on the bicep

Here is the same dog @ 2 yrs, training for PSA1

Hank video 1

https://www.facebook.com/melanie.howe.77/videos/10205851321866748/?l=1712968465752648458

Hank video 2

https://www.facebook.com/melanie.howe.77/videos/10205536617759342/?l=7886192606836654932

Pups on a sleeve is common in KNPV so not sure what the sarcasim is about.

 

The dog is 22 months old and is fine with sounds/ noises and rumble of urban nyc. The dog can and does take a tug from me and hang onto it calmly
Or try to take it away. Only 3 persons ( my family ) can approach this dog. So as soon as decoy approaches the tendency to defend over rides everything and the dog wants to bite decoy in a very intense way. She rips the sleeve from him but does not hold it . She drops it and goes at decoy again.
Would love her foundation to be in prey in prey and would not want trainer to spoil her.He says bec she willingly comes forward off the fence she may have the maturity to start bw , even though she is more defence driven .She has always been defensive but with age she gets more confident about being forward with it.  think trainer knows what he is doing, he was a helper at the WUSV in Philadelphia a few years ago.

No matter the numerical age of a dog...I always start any dogs from the very basic beginning (in training)...No matter if you're talking about Ob...Tracking or Protection...
There is the numerical age and the mental age and maturity...All must be taken into consideration...It's never a problem to start from the basic beginning...You can then progress accordingly...(Quickly or More Slowly)...
Hopefully we can all agree on one thing and that is that a dog should be a Balanced Animal...If we don't want this then we are watching a Liability in progress...
So whatever you do you should work towards creating a Balanced Dog...So although we may start a young dog off at what they bring to the table we must adjust our training and work at balancing it in it's thoughts and training...

~Bob~

Absolutely Q

Yeah I don't consider that a sleeve. That's a soft suit material.

Mithuna - best to post a vid of your dog / trainer / stresses, that would be fair on every one trying to help you.

What I will say about your bite query is - there are many, many dogs who will bite calmy on a sleeve, then piss themselves and never be seen again, when they are put under even MINIMUIM pressure lol. (For many that means shutting down way before  -  being merely screamed at / waving bunting whilst biting on a sleeve / suit)

Makes me want to puke - when natural behavior is frowned upon.

Example - all dogs on the bite will shake to kill . (but hey, some folk think - tell you what lets change mother nature)

Well that will work up to a point, and that point is ALWAYS when the shit hits the fan.

(Fortunately for most afficiandos of the above - the shit will never hit the fan, because there dogs will never be exposed to any credible stress / test  which would expose there short comings) 

Which is why you will see the following;
The vast majority of operational / real bites - dog rags the doll.
The overwhelming number of calm bites you will see - pressure is lame / contrived, and very, very well rehearsed, with a HUGE visual trigger -   EQUIPMENT.

Just to clarify - I am saying, if anyone thinks by trying to change millions of years of canine evolution, by training a dog in any protection discipline, not to shake / rag whilst on a bite - is an IDIOT. (Assuming GENUINE protection is the goal)

Those who disagree - show us serious pressure of your own dog engaging, without the HUGE visual trigger of a fat suit / sleeve - whilst under genuine physical stress.

Like I said at the top Mithuna - ping a visual over of your own dog / training, that will benefit you most re accurate feedback, all the best with your training.

R
Gee








 

Gee a head shake is a confident prey biting behavior and certainly something I prefer to see (especially on the suit or civil bite). I do not consider a head shake while the dog is pushing into the grip as an un-calm behavior. Repeatedly chewing and moving their grip with volcal frantic yanking is an un-calm behavior. JMO.

 

The ideal grip IMO is type where the predator is on the throat of it's prey waiting for it to die.

Hi GSD Fan,
I am sure we agree - ALWAYS engaging, then staying in the fight - is THE be all and end all.

R
Gee

Yes absolutely...which requires great care to build confidence in a novice dog in whatever drive they may bring to the table.