Training the down/sit stay - Page 1

Hi all My dog is now just over a year and although has sone well with the sit/down stays in the past has now decided to have a deaf ear when I request the sit or down stay. How do others get round this? What sort of correction would you give? Any help and advice will be greatly recived Jan

JanetS, Did you take the dog to the vet to get his ears checked out to make sure that he is deaf? If so then you can use other methods such as hand signals. If you aren't planning on titling him then that would be ok to use, of course. Brittany

Hello Jan, When and how does he 'break' the stays? Go back to BASICS - Put him back on the lead and train as if you were just teaching him. You do not want 'breaking' to become a habit!!! HOWEVER, this situation will simply be a SYMPTOM to something else! i.e. He KNOWS the exercise but obviously feels he does not need to take you seriously! Try to be aware of his behaviour and your responses to him in the home. Dogs can be very subtle, he will be taking little liberties, that you are not dealing with appropriately. (Even something as simple as 'repeating' yourself when you give him a command). Which then will lead to his lack of commitment to other things....!!! Hope this helps, Vixen

Janet, Try calming him in the position that you want. Clear eyed calmness. When he is down, place treets between his paws and let him nibble them while in place. Give him soothing praise as he eats his treats between his paws. Stroke him gently. Start putting distance between you and the dog as you go and replenish his small nibble supply between his paws from time to time. Put him at ease, calm him, make sure he is clear in eyes. He will respond to you. Stephen

Janet, your dog is going through puberty at this age, so expect some challenges in the next while. He is testing the waters, testing you, just like a human teenager would. He is looking for weak areas, and being the opportunist that every dog is, shamelessly taking advantage of any weakness he can find. Do not set yourself up for failure. This particular exercise is not the place where you carry out your battles. Otherwise the dog learns quickly that your power only goes as far as the end of the leash. Back to basics is a very good advice. Back to the leash, or 10 meter leash, back to the assistance of another person, etc. For the moment stick with what works well and easily for both of you and secure that. Be VERY consequent, but fair. If you get frustrated with a particular exercise or moment during training, move onto something different. Always end a session with something positive, something done well. For going back to the stay situation. Back to baby steps. Short time frame, short distance. Repeat, repeat, repeat. Lengthen time, lengthen distance, one at a time, then both together, then back to the easier part of the exercise. Short sessions, alternate them up by doing something the dog knows in his sleep or some play sessions, then back to the stay exercises. Move on to working with distractions while you are close by and in control. Reward control. Avoid getting all hyper when you reward, as this will cause the dog to move from its position. Pay attention to yourself as well. Is your eye contact for example enticing your dog to move? Or body movements, your overall conduct? You getting frustrated or nervous or anticipate the dog to break will get you a reaction from your dog. Start to pay attention to what makes him move and correct that with yourself if needed. When you have re-established control, start moving around the dog, step over it, while it is in the down for example. Have other people do the same. Then start putting him in a down, drop the leash, step on it (control), stay in place and ignore him. It has to become second nature, that down means down. I find it easier to work on the stay with the dog in the down. Only when this works well do we move on to the sit. Give the exercise a break for a few weeks every once in a while and focus on something different in the meantime. You did not mention if you are training for trials, or if this is for home use. If you train for SchH I usually recommend is to establish two sets of commands. One for the SchH field, which are ALWAYS non-negotiable. The other is for home use. Ie, on the SchH field you use Platz, at home you use down, lay down, etc. At the Platz I expect the dog to drop at an instance. At the down at home he can take his time, turn a few circles first, and get comfy. Finally - as long as you "request" something from your dog, you are always leaving the option open for the dog to deny that request. Pretty please is not going to do it. If one dog wants something from another, often all that is needed is a look! That is where you need to get. You need to learn that it is quite ok to demand unconditionally, that there is only one option to the demand, and that is that it WILL be fulfilled. Clear lines give dogs security. Whenever you give commands, give them LIKE YOU MEAN IT! If you have trouble with that, here is a little exercise before working with the dog: hold leash in hand without dog attached, say command to end of leash in a firm and loud and earnest voice, stompt foot down and finish command with "and I mean it!!!" Do this a few times, and then get dog and imagine what it felt like the moment you stomed your foot and said "and I mean it!". It will give your command more weight. Say each command only once but with determination. If you don't really mean it, why should any dog comply? Good luck.

Thank you all for your advice, I really do find it helpful. DH I am training for trials which is one of the reasons this is worrying me. I think it will be a very long time before I even attempt to enter into a trial. You mentioned puberty which I am aware he is going through but how long roughly does ths last for? He was castrated at 6 or 7 months. This was not my doing, the owner that had him before me had it done. I would of kept him intact if I had of been given the choice. I am quite firm with him but he still on occasion disobays my instuctions. I will follow advice your self and others have given and take it from there. I'll keep you all updated Thanks again Jan

Jan, your dog is just over a year. Of course he will continue to test you and not always obey (respond). He still has a lot of maturing to do, with or without family jewels in place, he will have his moments. And in training, there are always set backs. Even much later in the dogs life. How fortunate that he only disobeys on occasion ;o). Most people should be so lucky. Your dog is not a machine that can be programmed to execute command X previsely every time. For starters the commands are given in so many different flavors each time that there are not enough programs written to cover all. Hence different resonses/reactions to the commands and how they are presented. This is where persistence and consequence becomes important. There is a differene between firm and consequent. Disobedience/avoidance can also be a sign that you are expecting too much too soon. It could mean that the training methods you are using are not working for this particular dog, that you have a communication error. It could mean that you are not working at the dogs pace and ability. Focus on working with the dog as a team. The dog should not obey you. The dog should respond to you. Does that make sense??

No that made perfect sense thanks DH. Im not sure on correction though. I am training the dog myself so I dont really have many people to turn to for advice. I dont really correct him as such and if he doesn do a command I will put him in the sit/down what ever I have asked. I am quite firm with him but maybe I need to be a bit more. With matureing how long does this normally take? By what age should he be an adult so to speak? He is a very head strong dog, pushy I think the word would be but I wouldnt say I was a push over with him. Thanks once again Jan