Examples of outcross breedings and heavy linebreeding. - Page 1

Can someone please share with me a good example of an outcross breeding in German Shepherds, or a dog with minimal line-breeding?

What are some of the advantages and disadvantages of producing a dog who has little, to no linebreeding? How difficult is it to produce a dog like this?

On the flip side, what are some of the advantages of a heavily linebred dog? What is the highest inbreeding coefficient you would comfortably produce, or rather, what is the maximum amount of linebreeding you desire, or feel comfortable producing?

I have my own opinions on the subject, but seeing as how I am a pet owner and by no means an educated breeder, I'm curious to hear the opinions/answers of you more experienced folk.


I look forward to your repsonse.

in most breeds you can and will see that most strong producers have quite a bit inbreeding , and a strong poducer doesnot mean a dog that produced 3000 offspring from which for or five are in the picture again
in strong  malinoislines it is more common to use inbreeding than with german shepherds , something to think about

people say outcrossing produce healthyer dogs , truth is ,in the first generations you will have lesser chance of problems showing up , does this mean the problems are not  there , no way , they can pop out every next generation , and predictability of this happening is zero , as is the predictability of any other quality of the dog being passed on the next generation

second , and biggest problem of outcrossing is , in whatever breed you take; how many generations can you really outcross before all dogs in a breed are related pretty close and all of the breed is having the same genetic background somehow, where to go from there if you want to outcross or more importend if a big genetic disorder pops up , it will be possibly available in every dog in the breed


so to keep genetic diversity in a breed you need to have multiple lines with different genetic material so you can allways outcross when needet and if a genetic problem shows up in one line that cannot be bred out  , you will have plenty of dogs in the breed left that dont carry those genes


look at this pedigree of Da eder for example


http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/belgian_malinois/dog.html?id=300440 

This dog:  http://www.working-dog.eu/dogs_details.php?id=366512&new_lan_en

was bred back to this dog: http://www.working-dog.eu/dogs-details/179319/Bonnie-du-Val-dAuzon

This is the breeder : http://delacoquellerie.chiens-de-france.com/site_eleveur/index.php?ID_ELEVEUR=12528&ID_SITE=13998&ID_ACTU=286931&rub=actualites&page=detail

I am a little biased, as I have one of his dogs. He is not the only one in France that does this.

Here is what I bred with my Mals

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/belgian_malinois/dog.html?id=917059

The idea behind this is then you breed to a very strongly bred outcross.

no common ansestors in 5 generations
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=732393 

all of these have only 5-5 linebreeding.....
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=709425 

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=489359

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=703365

As I've been told.........true or not....
with "open" breeding the puppies are not as predictable, but they can have much more viggor - depending on the lines...

with close linebreeding, the goods and bads can be doubled up. So you can get the best of the best and the worst of the worst.

Thiis was my first attempt at a solid working line X   Produced 16 great pups


http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=553724

with close linebreeding, the goods and bads can be doubled up 

and that makes it very simple sitasmom , you continu with the goods and give the bads a good home without breedingrights , that is called selection

and you loose the ones with the bad genes from the breedingprogram

Unfortunately many don't care if a dog has papers and will breed these rejects and sell them for 200 - 500 ....
Backyard breeders and ignorant clients just looking for an inexpensive GSD for a pet....

Sitasmom,

I think you need to check your pedigrees again, you stated:
no common ansestors in 5 generations

That would be in correct.  Vanessa z Eurosportu is 5-4 on Ulk von Arlet and 5-4 on Merri vom Hirshel.  That seems like common ancestors in 5 generations to me.



all of these have only 5-5 linebreeding.....


I do not see a 5-5 linebreeding on Honey.  Honey does not have any linebreeding.

Unfortunately many don't care if a dog has papers and will breed these rejects and sell them for 200 - 500 ....
Backyard breeders and ignorant clients just looking for an inexpensive GSD for a pet....

Suddenly dogs with out papers are rejects?  I have had fantastic rescue dogs over the years all with out papers.  I test and select dogs for our K-9 unit and with the exception of mine, none have papers.  I can assure you the dogs in our unit are far from rejects and worth a whole lot to us.  How is Sita and the pup from your litter to Hero doing?  Has Hero or Sita been titled?  Has Hero been Xrayed and sent to OFA before breeding? 



  



  
 

Slam

Only trailer park trash low class backyard breeders would
breed dogs that are not at the very least xrayed...

I suppose it's even worse if a 'breeder' breeds a dog
that was xrayed and came back with bad hips/elbows,
that takes BYB to a whole new level.
Thats been done by a breeder on here too.