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by Ibrahim on 28 December 2013 - 17:12
I confess I was impressed with bebo's post but after reading OGBS's post I think it is more factual and convincing, anyway we haven't had such an educated discussion since quite a long time, I hope ddr gsd keeps the good job in directing this informative thread. Thanks OGB and thank you all for the valuable contributions to the subject.
Ibrahim
Ibrahim
by chvdberkt on 28 December 2013 - 17:12
ddr gsd wrote
I just viewed 2 excellent KNPV performances from:
MB - Max van Douwe Van Groningen & GSD
Caro Van B'Voort.
Does anyone own or personally seen progeny from
Caro?
My wife - owner of Kennel van de Wiersdijk - used Caro twice
In the first litter there are 4 dogs in KNPV training and 4 in IPO
http://www.phv-deverdedigers.nl/2013-12-03-19-42-31/bert
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=21y-4ipJ_bQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=xKviOm2cm_0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY94v0MMQoI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGpIOiOryjU
The second litter is now about 7 months old and from that litter there are 3 in KNPV (and 1 is living in Texas)
I just viewed 2 excellent KNPV performances from:
MB - Max van Douwe Van Groningen & GSD
Caro Van B'Voort.
Does anyone own or personally seen progeny from
Caro?
My wife - owner of Kennel van de Wiersdijk - used Caro twice
In the first litter there are 4 dogs in KNPV training and 4 in IPO
http://www.phv-deverdedigers.nl/2013-12-03-19-42-31/bert
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=21y-4ipJ_bQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=xKviOm2cm_0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY94v0MMQoI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGpIOiOryjU
The second litter is now about 7 months old and from that litter there are 3 in KNPV (and 1 is living in Texas)
by ddr gsd on 28 December 2013 - 18:12
OGBS - Excellent rebuttal. I, for one, do not disagree one iota on the KNPV
titled dominant pedigrees. Would you mind sharing the GSD in WUSV 3x
performance? When you say, "... genetically weaker dogs.", it goes even
further than just the 'sloppiness' of outing. It may involve leaking drive or just
an (OCD) compulsion of sorts. I will not speak for others, as they will chime
in on their experience and expertise. It could just be as simple as a cracked
tooth or other physiological distress. Phenotype - "If it looks like a duck...".
My preference will stand with KNPV (rules)!
Good points!
titled dominant pedigrees. Would you mind sharing the GSD in WUSV 3x
performance? When you say, "... genetically weaker dogs.", it goes even
further than just the 'sloppiness' of outing. It may involve leaking drive or just
an (OCD) compulsion of sorts. I will not speak for others, as they will chime
in on their experience and expertise. It could just be as simple as a cracked
tooth or other physiological distress. Phenotype - "If it looks like a duck...".
My preference will stand with KNPV (rules)!
Good points!
by ddr gsd on 28 December 2013 - 18:12
chvdberkt - Thanks. I will take a peek and I am
sure others will too.
sure others will too.
by OGBS on 28 December 2013 - 18:12
Ibrahim,
Thanks for the kind words.
Just to be sure, I am not being entirely dismissive of what Bebo or a few others have said.
I just do not agree that the KNPV dogs are much different or coming from a different place than where proof shows them to be coming from.
In other words, the courage, hardness, aggression and fight drive they seek in GSD's is coming out of IPO lines and that is impossible to deny.
Chvdberkt,
They look like some nice pups. Congratulations to your wife.
It's always good to see people trying to produce good dogs.
Thanks for the kind words.
Just to be sure, I am not being entirely dismissive of what Bebo or a few others have said.
I just do not agree that the KNPV dogs are much different or coming from a different place than where proof shows them to be coming from.
In other words, the courage, hardness, aggression and fight drive they seek in GSD's is coming out of IPO lines and that is impossible to deny.
Chvdberkt,
They look like some nice pups. Congratulations to your wife.
It's always good to see people trying to produce good dogs.
by OGBS on 28 December 2013 - 18:12
DDR-GSD,
Take a look at the Full Force breeding on the dam side.
The father of Kim is a 3xWUSV competitor that came out of KNPV dogs.
Take a look at the Full Force breeding on the dam side.
The father of Kim is a 3xWUSV competitor that came out of KNPV dogs.
by ddr gsd on 28 December 2013 - 18:12
chvdberkt - After clicking on the first address, the location
jumped out that you from NL! We did get someone from there.
Do you have some time to discuss with the forum members on
KNPV? Anything related to KNPV, training, pedigree, you name
it. I am sure you have a wealth of information. And I am sure the
forum members will respectfully dialogue or just listen in.
Thanks!
jumped out that you from NL! We did get someone from there.
Do you have some time to discuss with the forum members on
KNPV? Anything related to KNPV, training, pedigree, you name
it. I am sure you have a wealth of information. And I am sure the
forum members will respectfully dialogue or just listen in.
Thanks!
by Ibrahim on 28 December 2013 - 18:12
I understand, the dogs are the same and from same dogs, depends on the breeder to do smart selective breeding from best offspring. KNPV and IPO are tools to understand one's dogs and test them, their genes and capabilities. a good speceimen GSD can and should be able to do either IPO or KNPV.
KNPV being a training or pass certificate for a dog to join Police is a good thing in my opinion, but I'm not convinced KNPV dog is something else other than the GSD we know that is titled in IPO, and I'm not talking about extreme sportish GSDs, with unbalanced drives. Am I on track?
Ibrahim
KNPV being a training or pass certificate for a dog to join Police is a good thing in my opinion, but I'm not convinced KNPV dog is something else other than the GSD we know that is titled in IPO, and I'm not talking about extreme sportish GSDs, with unbalanced drives. Am I on track?
Ibrahim
by ddr gsd on 28 December 2013 - 18:12
OGBS - yes! I was thinking I know what he is talking about.
But sometimes your brain is blonding for the moment.
And furthermore, I apologize for mentioning a different thread
for you, but cooler heads will prevail. Now, if we can just
have that gentleman from NL chime in for some other
powerful insight. Thanks
But sometimes your brain is blonding for the moment.
And furthermore, I apologize for mentioning a different thread
for you, but cooler heads will prevail. Now, if we can just
have that gentleman from NL chime in for some other
powerful insight. Thanks
by ddr gsd on 28 December 2013 - 18:12
My prejudicial angle is: if a GSD is titled through KNPV, the probability
of the progeny will have a greater chance in attaining KNPV cert. And
if the owner chooses IPO or other venues, they have a double/triple
chance of success in that arena. My philosophical thought process. Now
you can digest it, tear it to pieces, dismantle the thought process, or res-
pectfully disagree with me. Now, if it is IPO to KNPV, the chances may
be slim, unless the dog has the necessary 'hard' characteristics.
I've got to peek into the website address above.
of the progeny will have a greater chance in attaining KNPV cert. And
if the owner chooses IPO or other venues, they have a double/triple
chance of success in that arena. My philosophical thought process. Now
you can digest it, tear it to pieces, dismantle the thought process, or res-
pectfully disagree with me. Now, if it is IPO to KNPV, the chances may
be slim, unless the dog has the necessary 'hard' characteristics.
I've got to peek into the website address above.
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