VK4 ? - Page 7

Ramage - well said.

Regards
Gee

Well there is no more I can say . That's my opinion it way to easily twisted because u don't know me personally and I don't know you . If we did you would understand my views but may not agree

Yogidog - no offence to you or any other poster on this topic.

I can assure you and all other posters on this subject, I do not tar you with the same idiot brush as VK4.

My rant was borne out of anger at those who have tried to contribute and were needlessly slapped down by VK4.

For instance, a few weeks back a lad who had never posted before.

Sought advice, his post was courteous, clear and he posted a vid.

VK4 replied in his usual shitty way, result the guy was run out of town.

Now, that poor sod, did nowt wrong and did not deserve such treatment.

Where is the support for folks like him. (I have no doubt he was one of many)

Many people will be put off contributing, knowing if they stick there heads above the parapit, they will get humiliated, and that is a shame, because no matter what the topic is, so long as people are reasonably well mannered  - every one benefits. (and who knows, we might even learn from each other)

Regards
Gee
 

Gee iv never read any offensive in any of your posts your a good dog man and I find your post and your self very knowledgeable about real dogs so keep it up
About Vk he a bit mouthy no doubt but he loves his dogs he receive harsh criticism and sometimes gives harsh criticism but I still think he's is a good guy find he speaks from the cuff and I like that but I'm not easily offenend

Its funny, you hear over and over "lets clean up the trash so we can all talk civilly about dogs". Have seen this on several forums with always the same result. The inevitable result is always a ghost town with the exception of the usual pet posts that drive very little interest. The same thing happened on the GSD forum, workingdog forum etc.

The best way to kill a forum is to remove all the controversial posters.  These posters drive traffic and actually draw interest instead of drive it away, which is another myth that is often perpetrated.  

No one particularly cares what Sally pet owner has to say about her dog not bringing his ball back or how cute your new puppy is.  Thats filler not meat.

I would not tolerate racism or threats of physical violence. Beyond that, leave it be or you destroy the dynamic that drives interest, creates discussion and enjoyable discourse.

 

Funny Haz I get more feedback from those who say they won't post here because of the fighting, the rudeness and lack of civility, than I do from those seeking drama or those seeking to start drama. If you are looking for drama, I have heard Daytime Soaps are a real good source. I have also heard reddit is a great place for the drama searching souls to get their fix. I think you are wrong.

 

Here is what happens instead - the good posters (who aren't all about the drama) leave because they get tired of the non-sense and so the moderators crack down on the drama addicts and surprise there isn't anyone left. Go figure. I have been doing this gig for 5 years now and that is exactly what has happened. How can the serious dog people feel about a bunch of drama queens when they seriously want to talk about dogs in a civil respectful manner.

Why do you think the real pros won't post here, because they are tired of listening to the wannabe drama queens stirring shit up. Think hard Haz how many pros post here beyond a couple. Not many want to know why - because of people like VK and the numerous iterations over the years.

If this place turns into a place for pet people to talk about their dog Buddy and it is civil and respectful, I can accept that. And I am thinking a lot of breeders can accept that because the site will be ripe for the selling of dogs to those boring pet people.

Like I said earlier you want drama and fighting flip on the TV and watch As the World Turns so do The Days of Our Lives. We will move on.

Oh and one more thing why is it that those who cause drama and stress for others don't seem to be able to take the same from the admin and run off like weak dogs?

So true so very true......'Oh and one more thing why is it that those who cause drama and stress for others don't seem to be able to take the same from the admin and run off like weak dogs?'

I think many times on “anonymous forums” the issue comes down to not knowing everyone’s credentials. So you really don’t know who you’re talking to or how well they know the subject. In real life, most people know each other’s accomplishments and achievements. It’s hard to come up to a person that’s done more than you and start “teaching” them how things should be done when you have clearly not done them yourself. On the internet, and especially on these types of forums, your most novice of sport or show people have done exponentially more than the majority of the pet people and so they feel like they finally have a place to air their opinion. I’ve also seen how people with real credentials get inflated as well. So even when they have accomplished something, they make it out to be way more than it truly is, and again, are only able to do this because the people they’re speaking with are way less knowledgeable than anyone in real life.

I’ve noticed that Facebook is much more “civil” when it comes to sport or breed discussions. But I also notice that it also prevents many from posting or voicing an opinion because they know that the people also in the discussion will dismiss them anyways due to lack of credentials. So then we don’t get new ideas or opinions thrown into the pot. All too often, new/groundbreaking/refreshing is dismissed in the dog world, it’s one of the only parts of our lives where people still want to live in the past and not evolve (mostly because evolution many times forces the establishment to admit they’re not the end all be all).

, very true. I have gotten PMs from people who have done very well in the dog world and they say things like these people who think they know it all don't actually know jack. I have also received PMs from members laughing at a few K-9 officers here because they talk a great game but in reality know little when their audience is a group just starting out they look really good but the real pros know better. But put them up against real trainers and their knowledge is actually very limited in scope.

 

I am a pet person so my knowledge in training is very limited but I can admit it and accept it and not try and act like I know more than the next pet person. Trainers, breeders and people who show should really look at how they present their knowledge because there is always someone with more knowledge, experience and who has actually acheived their goals.

 

BTW, very well thought out post.

There are "pros" in IPO, PP, street work, scent work, showing ( AKC/SV style), agility, Ringsport, Mondioring, KNPV, nowadays dockdiving and dancing, and on and on. Pet owners, IPO club level handlers, brokers, professional handlers ( be it show or sport ).
Besides that, what is a "pro"? For me at least 90% of the members of this board, including me, are "lovers", a "pro" in my language is someone who wants to make money first and foremost.

But all of them do have their own "vision", better, worse? Simply different, and they need different characters of dogs. As long as they love the breed, and take good care of their dog, it´s fine for me. All of you never should forget about the personal goals ( and the roots ) of your counterpart. What´s their personal goal with the dog in question? All of them will have different goals, and all of them will have different arguments.
Maybe all of us should try to scrutinize the agenda of others, most often by then their answers make perfect sense. What´s their goal? What´s their intention?
Although Haz is not very diplomatic, he is on solid ground. Talking about the newest hair dryer for dogs is not very interesting, and nobody, even not new members, can await that members of an international "pedigree" dog forum applause to every backyard breeding. I guess they don´t post not because of rude answers, but because tey know the answers in the forefield. People are not stupid, they know...
Although most of the members here are US Americans, the standard for the German Shepherd dog was not made in the United States, and the AKC is not the end of all, why should people on an "International" board lower the standard to the US standard?
I try to be friendly and factual, but let´s be honest, that´s not always easy...