Careless Hillary - Page 2

I'm not saying Clinton cares about me but Trump is reaching out to the uneducated, the racists, the xenophobes, and the douchebags. Let me explain the douchebags. The douchebags are white males who are upset that they can't go around in public talking like Howard Stern. They see Trump as an un-PC alpha male who they can live vicariously through.

He doesn't hit any of my buttons. I have no fear of illegals taking my job. If an illegal could do my job it says something about me. I don't believe they are coming here and raping and murdering. I don't care if they speak Spanish. I think a wall is not only impractical and would be ineffective but it won't be happening regardless. I'm not falling for it. I don't fear Muslims and a ban won't be happening and it's a stupid idea. What I do can't be outsourced to China and those jobs that were sent there are not coming back. Trump is not going to wave a magic wand and make China send them back. The fact he tries to make China look like the bad guy in this is something else that doesn't move me. China didn't steal those jobs, Americans sent them there. He sent jobs there.

Like I said, I would not have made a good Nazi as I can't shut off the rational part of my brain and draw comfort from hearing what I want to hear. Make America great again? Blah, blah, blah. I didn't think America was no longer great.

I understand about the douchebags. I've read their douchebaggery posts from your exiled home forum. I never believed in the wall myself. Concerning most of your other comments regarding the off the cuff/wall Trump comments, I too, saw them as impossible. I am a bit fed up with knee jerk PC condemnations, however. Those become their own hypocrisy and excuse for intolerance, as far as I am concerned.

I read your Nazi comment the first time, and choose to ignore it. It might be that the douchbaggery crowd are skinheads, too. I just don't think Trump is philosophically what I would call a true Nazi, himself. Egotistic, narcissistic, brash, hasty and bombastic, yes, those words do fit Trump.

There are aspects to American society today that are indeed gone, and arguably regrettable. You might not sympathize in that vein because I suspect you aren't sporting grey hairs, yet? I might be wrong. Also, I haven't heard you mention kids, so I'm thinking you don't have any?

The middle class has changed and is struggling, and that I believe is real. The middle class has always been the backbone of America. Redistribution of wealth, through millionaire class taxation, minimum wage increases and relying on government support programs is just not a sustainable fix for a society with a middle class based on services and consumption. It isn't a fair exchange for a middle class that keeps on losing its skilled blue collar, high wage paying jobs that were traditionally found in production and manufacturing. IMHO

China can be an opportunity. Their people and their leaders aren't what I would call, interchangeable. My father has businesses there, so I can't complain about China in some ways others might. It is a mistake not to understand them culturally, however, and how that sensibility translates with their attitudes about doing business. It is a shame the price China is paying in economic growth also trades off in an unhealthy ecology.

Still, I don't see how I'll ever trust Hillary and that just makes it impossible for me to support her with my vote. Trump is too much of a wild card. I think we need to believe our leaders have a plan that makes sense so it can deliver, and I haven't heard any thing like that from Trump. I really can't see me voting for either one. I never thought I'd say that, either. But that is the rock and hard place, I am at.

When I say Nazi I am not talking about Nazism but the mentality of those who succumb to fascist rhetoric. The people who fall for Trump's rhetoric are the same type of people who fell for Hitler and Mussolini. The thing to consider is that Hitler didn't come out and say he was going to start the Holocaust. He didn't use that to convince people to follow him and gain power. I'm not saying that if Trump became president his talk of a wall and banning Muslims would turn to genocidal policies but the methodology he is using to convince people to vote for him follows the pattern that fascist leaders have used. I wouldn't have made a good Nazi for the same reasons I can't vote for Trump.

One of the first things a fascist leader does is create an enemy. Umberto Eco wrote that if your true enemies are too strong you create weaker ones. Minorities are weak. Hitler went after the Jews, Trump is going after Mexicans and Muslims. I'm not saying he is going to take it as far as Hitler did but he is following the same pattern when it comes to acquiring power.

Are Mexicans and Muslims the true enemies of the middle class? Are they true threats to our liberty?

When someone like Sanders says he wants to make college free that is doing something for the middle class. In this economy education is the key to getting a job. It is the key to social mobility. Most of the new jobs that have been created require a college degree. But when voters care more about gay marriage, abortion, Muslims, immigrants, guns, and bathrooms you see why some are destined to never get ahead. How many of these issues have a direct effect on the average American's life? Gay marriage isn't holding anyone back from getting a job or getting an education. How many people are unemployed because of abortion or Muslims? How many Americans have lost jobs to illegal Mexicans compared to losing jobs to countries overseas or automation here at home? And if one did lose a job to an illegal who is to blame? The illegal or the employer?

Not the businessman, no way, unheard of, impossible.

I agree GSD Admin, that painting the business man, Trump as someone planning to become a successful fascist leader of the USA is far fetched. Not that I don't enjoy the scholarly history lessons provided by Noitsyou, because I do. "The Art of the Deal" is hardly a blueprint for a rally call for fascism.

I also think the hot button issues listed and marginalized all at once are skillfully used out of their contexts to avoid the on topic question and subject of this thread: Hillary, how will her pattern of carelessness and entitlement manifest as POTUS? What do we expect will be her accomplishments based on her past? What do folks consider her greatest accomplishments to date, for that matter? I come up with a blank on that one, myself.

Sanders and the attractive promise of free college sounds great. Is that supposed to be an unfunded mandate, too? What about the people who aren't college aptitude or temperament? This too, could make a new thread topic and not deflect away from what looks like will be our country's unavoidable fate: Careless Hillary.
 

He likes dictators, talks about them often. Wants to meet them but you are right he is not fascist. SMH.

Didn't Obama go to Cuba? Why should showing willingness to speak to some of the worlds most powerful leaders be a negative? Talking to them isn't the same as becoming them. Seems to me a seat at the table has its advantages regarding understandings that could lead to closing the gaps in differences for any type of compromise. Keep shaking your head, maybe it will make some things more clear for you.

I'm not saying that Trump is a fascist but he is an authoritarian, even Ron Paul said that, who is using the same tactics as fascists. The fact he will always mention an opponent's name with a title of sorts, like "crooked" Hillary or "lying" Cruz, is an example of fascist rhetoric.

As far as the topic goes, I already said that it won't matter. You have people who wanted Clinton from the start and if you are asking them to now choose Trump it won't happen. For them it's a choice between someone who may be guilty of some wrongdoing and poor judgement, which doesn't really make her stand out when it comes to politics, and someone who is a xenophobic loudmouth who brings zero substance to the discussion. I would prefer Clinton, a liar who is competent, over Trump, a liar who is incompetent. The guy was/is a birther.

As far as patterns, what president hasn't shown some pattern of carelessness and entitlement? And has Trump not shown the exact same thing?

Oh it gets clearer everyday on what I see and read here. Especially if you read between the lines. BTW, Cuba is not North Korea.

Noitsyou: I am not asking any one to vote for Trump, as I won't vote for him either. Trump became a big disappointment for me, exactly because he showed a lack of depth and complete lack of refinement needed for the Oval office. Not sure where that was not understood. If you are name dropping Ron Paul thinking I am one of those crazies, lol, well--sorry, but I am going to disappoint you there, too.

I really think my point is to see how low some folks are willing to drop the bar for Hillary in order to make her seem palatible. Apparently, there is no limit to that, the bar could be laying on the ground and all that will happen is someone will begin to dig her a tunnel.

GSD Admin: I know Cuba isn't North Korea. You think I didn't understand that? What I don't understand is your vagueness, and veiled condemnation... of something. Oh well, what I do know, is you like it like that. Feel free to clue me in though, as I would hate for you to make an error to my detriment, or simply, if it will help relieve me of my stupidity. (I know you are doing somersaults of joy with Noitsyou posting in such a welcoming liberal vein! I hope you still will allow me to post true to myself in spite of my having admitted to some conservatism in my views.)

Now, as far as patterns being mentioned, and to answer the question about certain presidents who I consider were not careless or focused on entitlement, I have two in mind from the latter part of presidential history. I would say Reagan was certainly very careful, not the least bit careless and he is well known to have had a folksy way about him that made him appealing to a broad base.

And then secondly, I will name Jimmy Carter, because while he was largely unsuccessful or just plain unlucky with his presidency, I would not ever call him careless or displaying entitlement character. As a matter of fact his legacy in philanthropy far outshines his presidential term's legacy because he is not at all careless or elitist in accomplishing those goals.

JMHO