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by Donald Deluxe on 10 March 2011 - 19:03
Mystere, Sue indeed has a big heart. Out of respect for that I'll give Nona a pass for her role in this if she apologizes to Sock Puppet.
But as for Maggie, nope, sorry, can't do that - I don't negotiate with terrorists and no one can negotiate with sociopaths.
But as for Maggie, nope, sorry, can't do that - I don't negotiate with terrorists and no one can negotiate with sociopaths.
by Bob McKown on 10 March 2011 - 21:03
You guys are burning up alot of good oxygen on this?.
by Mystere on 10 March 2011 - 21:03
Nona:
You engaged in precisely the behavior I described and for the reasons I attributed. YOU have not acknowledged that, nor have you offered any type of apology to Sock Puppet, et al, for the posts and statements you made at the time.
To keep crying that you are falsely accused of making statements that per se supported Bartmess ( eg. " Janice is a wonderful person and never did those things. You are all wrong") is playing victim and disingenuous. No one said you made such per se statements and your demand that someone show you such statements is disingenuous. Obviously, now you are embarassed that you could not bring yourself to deal with the actual facts of that situation, rather than the messengers.
IF, by some miracle, roles were reversed,you and Maggs were the ones vindicated here, and I had posted against you in the manner you two did against SP, Hodie, Jim, Jackie, et al, I might have to swallow hard, but, YES, I would acknowledge that I had issued the posts I did because of my enmity toward you, not the actual facts, and apologize for it. Then, move on. I would do that, even with individuals who have aimed racist crap at me. I'd still despise them, though. ( I'm not saying that close friendships are likely to grow out of anything here.)
By no means do I suggest (or expect) that you, Sue, Jackie, Sock Puppet, Jim, Hodie, maggs etc. will ever all break into song with a couple of verses of Kumbaya. Not even were we all taken hostage by Al Queda and rescued by Delta Force is that likely to happen. 
I am simply suggesting that, perhaps, some of us have learned from this experience that we can disagree without being disagreeable (name-calling, insulting, making racist/sexist/_ist remarks, and generally being nasty because of which poster is making a statement) and discuss issues in a civil manner. That is what I mean by moving on.
And, for the record, an actual apology does not contain the words "if" and/or "but."
You engaged in precisely the behavior I described and for the reasons I attributed. YOU have not acknowledged that, nor have you offered any type of apology to Sock Puppet, et al, for the posts and statements you made at the time.
To keep crying that you are falsely accused of making statements that per se supported Bartmess ( eg. " Janice is a wonderful person and never did those things. You are all wrong") is playing victim and disingenuous. No one said you made such per se statements and your demand that someone show you such statements is disingenuous. Obviously, now you are embarassed that you could not bring yourself to deal with the actual facts of that situation, rather than the messengers.
IF, by some miracle, roles were reversed,you and Maggs were the ones vindicated here, and I had posted against you in the manner you two did against SP, Hodie, Jim, Jackie, et al, I might have to swallow hard, but, YES, I would acknowledge that I had issued the posts I did because of my enmity toward you, not the actual facts, and apologize for it. Then, move on. I would do that, even with individuals who have aimed racist crap at me. I'd still despise them, though. ( I'm not saying that close friendships are likely to grow out of anything here.)
By no means do I suggest (or expect) that you, Sue, Jackie, Sock Puppet, Jim, Hodie, maggs etc. will ever all break into song with a couple of verses of Kumbaya.
Not even were we all taken hostage by Al Queda and rescued by Delta Force is that likely to happen. I am simply suggesting that, perhaps, some of us have learned from this experience that we can disagree without being disagreeable (name-calling, insulting, making racist/sexist/_ist remarks, and generally being nasty because of which poster is making a statement) and discuss issues in a civil manner. That is what I mean by moving on. And, for the record, an actual apology does not contain the words "if" and/or "but."
by Mystere on 10 March 2011 - 21:03
I understand, Don. I guess for some reason I am having an attack of optimism and actually think that this could be a learning opportunity for all us. Maybe it is due to too much caffeine...
I guess for some reason I am having an attack of optimism and actually think that this could be a learning opportunity for all us. Maybe it is due to too much caffeine... 
by nonacona60 on 10 March 2011 - 22:03
Mystere wrote: "nor have you offered any type of apology to Sock Puppet, et al, for the posts and statements you made at the time. "
If SP is one that made an effort to end the mess with Janice, Than yes, I have acknowledged the effort of all those who did...If thats not good enough for you, it ends there for me......But if you still think I didn't, thats ok too....You believe what you want...
As for apologizing to SP for anything, IT AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN.....I will never apologize to the person who had done nothing but insulted us, called me and my daughter names, and made up stories about us to defame us...One name that comes to mind is "SWAMP RATS" and thats just one of many......But I guess thats ok for SP to do the name calling, but when we started calling names back, it was a horrible low life thing to do....So no there will be no apology to SP...
Embarrassed, I AM NOT!!!! I have done nothing to be embarrassed about.....But if it makes you feel better to think I am, than go ahead and make yourself feel better, its okay..
I do apologize to the one's that I have hurt and insulted due to that fact it was because of frustrations induced by someone else.....I do want to move on and try to not get caught up in a web again.....I will admit I was a sucker when I first joined here.....No, I didn't know alot about anyone on here...Now That I look back, somethings back than, did appear to be different than what they actually were......I am not going to go into details, for the fear of hashing it back up.....
This will be my last response to this topic....Those who want to continue down this path, go on, but I'm taking the other direction the fork in the road offers.....I can pretend some things never happened and move on, but somethings I will always remember and still have issues trying to pretend that they never happened...PEACE TO EVERYONE....
If SP is one that made an effort to end the mess with Janice, Than yes, I have acknowledged the effort of all those who did...If thats not good enough for you, it ends there for me......But if you still think I didn't, thats ok too....You believe what you want...
As for apologizing to SP for anything, IT AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN.....I will never apologize to the person who had done nothing but insulted us, called me and my daughter names, and made up stories about us to defame us...One name that comes to mind is "SWAMP RATS" and thats just one of many......But I guess thats ok for SP to do the name calling, but when we started calling names back, it was a horrible low life thing to do....So no there will be no apology to SP...
Embarrassed, I AM NOT!!!! I have done nothing to be embarrassed about.....But if it makes you feel better to think I am, than go ahead and make yourself feel better, its okay..
I do apologize to the one's that I have hurt and insulted due to that fact it was because of frustrations induced by someone else.....I do want to move on and try to not get caught up in a web again.....I will admit I was a sucker when I first joined here.....No, I didn't know alot about anyone on here...Now That I look back, somethings back than, did appear to be different than what they actually were......I am not going to go into details, for the fear of hashing it back up.....
This will be my last response to this topic....Those who want to continue down this path, go on, but I'm taking the other direction the fork in the road offers.....I can pretend some things never happened and move on, but somethings I will always remember and still have issues trying to pretend that they never happened...PEACE TO EVERYONE....
by Slamdunc on 10 March 2011 - 22:03
Mystere,
What you are attempting is very commendable, I for one applaud you. But, a leopard can't change it's spots. Oprah Winfrey said it best when she said "The first time some one shows you who they really are; believe them." We have been shown over and over the character and temperament of some of the individuals involved. Funny, if they were GSD's they would never pass a breed survey.
What you are attempting is very commendable, I for one applaud you. But, a leopard can't change it's spots. Oprah Winfrey said it best when she said "The first time some one shows you who they really are; believe them." We have been shown over and over the character and temperament of some of the individuals involved. Funny, if they were GSD's they would never pass a breed survey.
by Red Sable on 10 March 2011 - 23:03
by VomMarischal on 10 March 2011 - 23:03
I think Nona thinks "apologize" and "move on" mean the same thing. If that is so, Nona, your apology is accepted.
by steve1 on 10 March 2011 - 23:03
Reading these posts make me wonder how many of you Guys think, For Christs sake what is there in words spoken on a forum how can Nona get upset by a few words which she does not like to here namely from Sock Puppet, Now if you had been given a smack in the mouth that i could understand but not a few meaningless words.
It is the despicable wickedness of this Janet Bartmess which is the subject of this thread who was right or wrong matters not,
i am sure Sock does not need any kind of Sorry i was wrong messages from the people who
doubted what he said at the time.
All we can hope is that this woman goes to jail for a very long time,
I wish i was the Judge in the case for sure, mercy would be a rare thing with me in areas of this gravity She would pay the price in full
Steve1
It is the despicable wickedness of this Janet Bartmess which is the subject of this thread who was right or wrong matters not,
i am sure Sock does not need any kind of Sorry i was wrong messages from the people who
doubted what he said at the time.
All we can hope is that this woman goes to jail for a very long time,
I wish i was the Judge in the case for sure, mercy would be a rare thing with me in areas of this gravity She would pay the price in full
Steve1
by Mystere on 10 March 2011 - 23:03
Jim,
Well, I tried. I think VM may be right that some folks equate "moving on" with a quasi-apology and/or recognition that they were wrong. The fact that nona, at least, now recongizes that some of what she directed at people had nothing to do with the Bartmess issue and more to do with her "frustration" speaks volumes. Frankly, I give her credit for acknowledging that. I can fully understand that some things are unforgiveable and unforgettable; I feel the same way.
But, I am now done with any attempts to "mediate." I still believe that this has been a learning experience and I believe that we will see the effects of that in future posts from nearly everyone. Of course, there will probably be the irredeemable exceptions. We shall see.
Well, I tried.
I think VM may be right that some folks equate "moving on" with a quasi-apology and/or recognition that they were wrong. The fact that nona, at least, now recongizes that some of what she directed at people had nothing to do with the Bartmess issue and more to do with her "frustration" speaks volumes. Frankly, I give her credit for acknowledging that. I can fully understand that some things are unforgiveable and unforgettable; I feel the same way. But, I am now done with any attempts to "mediate." I still believe that this has been a learning experience and I believe that we will see the effects of that in future posts from nearly everyone. Of course, there will probably be the irredeemable exceptions. We shall see.
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