SV going to change the rules - Page 4

See...what worries me about that new stuff is that not every dog needs to be handled by strangers. It's a very "pet" thing and sounds a ton like the CGC. Could it be used as a test of temperament? Sure. But breeding? I don't know. Not all dogs like being touched, there's no fault in that. Does a dog get DQ'd from breeding because it's a strong/dominant dog that doesn't like strangers touching it? It's part of why many BH tests have removed touching of the dog by strangers...why is that necessary? If I'm walking down the street...no one NEEDS to touch my dog.

That test is just too easy...no obedience, no work by the breeder. A golden retriever could pass that test and we're going to make it out to be the GSD breed standard now? It's sad really...

I remember my first AD and BH , my dog bit the judge after his AD test ( judge reached for His front leg without asking me ) luckily I caught the dog by the scruff really quickly and he only caught the loose shirt ,and the judge was a old school SCH guy and was cool about it ... I praised the dog for it , again on a BH test the judge reached for the dog and the dog quickly snapped .. all my dogs are social but none of them will ever let u reach for them ( unless they offer it ) or grab them in any shape or form.. I wouldn't own a dog that isn't sharp with strangers and won't show civil aggression when approached that's not what a working Gsd is suppose to be !! (I always tell people , if U can get them out of the kennel/crate/truck you can have them )There's absolutely no reason why any judge should touch , pet or invade the dogs comfort zone . Even at dog clubs whether it's ipo or psa etc nobody pets or interacts with other members dogs unless it's a young pup . Unfortunately this is what the SV and ipo wants and there's some of us out there that would never go along and will continue to breed for AGGRESSION and sharpness. 

"...not every dog needs to be handled by strangers ..."

 

Just a thought, but when I lived in London I would often walk dogs through crowded streets (you had to, to get to anywhere). Many times some passer-by - adult or more often child - would 'stroke' the dog by just reaching out a hand as they passed us by on the pavements. Now, okay they "shouldn't" have; the correct way to approach any dog is to walk up slowly and ask its handler first, and all that ... but they did. Personally I'm quite glad, at one level, that we still live in a world where many are not yet too scared of all dogs,  or maybe bigger dogs, to enjoy and relate to those dogs in society. Reminds me of my own childhood.

BUT for this to be 'coped with', you have to have a dog whose temperament you can rely on, for it to do NO MORE THAN freeze, if it does not 'enjoy' being suddenly touched by a complete stranger, yes ???

BW very good last post, maybe if responsible breeders didn't change the temperament, or be more discriminating about who they sell to, the popularity of the breed would decrease. This breeding for pets because people are irresponsible or everyone deserves to have one if they desire regardless of circumstances.....is sick and sad and destructive.

Because people make asinine decisions to take liberty to pet, or touch someone's dog,( especially a dog that by standard is bred to be protective and work in protective work) should not encourage breeders to dummy down the breed. Dogs are people's personal possession and you should not access them without acquiring permission from the owners. Parents should teach their children to ask and respect other people's possessions. All my dogs were able to be petted, but after puppyhood, I never encouraged it and only allowed it with people that the dog was familiar with and I knew wouldn't do dumb stuff.

Ah, yes, here we go again....'my dog is a badass, and he doesn't have to allow anyone to touch him'.

No, your dog is an asshat, if he's so freakin' antisocial that he won't tolerate the touch of a neutral, non-threatening stranger.

Good luck getting veterinary care for that dog; better pray your house or kennel never catches fire and you're not there to drag the dog out, either. Hope you plan on muzzling the dog any time you take it out in public, too. Should your dog ever become lost--perhaps a vehicle crash where the dog is thrown out of the vehicle--be prepared for the it to be shot and killed if you're out of commission, no one else is able to get near the dog to recapture it, and it won't enter a live trap.

The GSD is supposed to be aloof, not ignorant.

No one is saying the dog is badass, my best friend is a Vet, and they routinely deal with dogs that don't want to be touched( from all breeds) ......so much for the drama. He also owns a large pet hotel and experienced folks handle anti social dogs all the time when folks have to travel....smh, but a neutral person doesn't have the right to just pet my dog without asking, and if I don't think they are good for my dog even if they are neutral/friendly that is my prerogative. And I would bet my dogs are more temperament sound than most of you, but I still reserve right to regulate access to them.

I want my dogs when in my car or house when I'm not there, to trust no one they don't know until they are told it's alright. No matter how neutral/ friendly they are. 

 

The issue to me isn't whether he will or won't, its whether folks show proper decorum and not be presumptuous. Ask if you can pet and accept decision, teach your children the same....responsibility!

Dogs are aloof, people are ignorant!

 

Wasn't referring to your post, Gustav. I know your dogs are stable enough to be out in public. We were posting at the same time.

For heaven's sake, there's no excuse for a dog that's having a breed survey, or doing a BH or AD, to not permit the judge to touch them--if the dog doesn't care for it, then train the damn dog to tolerate when you say it must, because you said so. THAT'S being a handler. A dog that attempts to bite the judge is supposed to fail the temperament portion of the test.

I don't encourage strangers--or even people they're familiar with--to touch my dogs for no reason, either, but by the same token there are times when it is necessary, and other times when it's just unavoidable even though you'd rather they not do it.

I agree wholeheartedly Hexe, I misinterpreted your thoughts.

No worries, Gustav. :)

Hexe your mentality is why the breed of GSD suffers , and why there's so many weak dogs not just physically but nerves..I saw you are into showline gsd, now I know !! ....I wish responsible breeders would never sell pups to people like you.. I've seen too many good dogs get ruined by that mentality. This is why I would never sell a pup to a pet home/ women handlers or anyone who is against dominant aggression and sharpness in a dog . And yes my dogs have all muzzle fought the vet and the staff and my vet works with and boards police k9s, he understands this type of dogs. Just part of the job.
Now I understand that a dog that possesss so much sharpness may not be for you but don't contribute to ruining the breed , get a golden retriever or a Labrador , maybe even a corgi or stick to showlines but dont pretend you know what you're talking about when It comes to REAL dogs.