Push, pull and shake? Or not? - Page 2

Susie- Thanks for clearing that up:

Shaking" - no loss of points
"Thrashing" - no loss of points
"Pulling" - no loss of points

I have read several times over the years , the  theory that dogs that shake prey/toys, are weak nerved. 

Which never really made sense to me... and seemed like a too general statement.

Can anyone explain, give their 2 cents,  or clear that one up?

Shaking=weak nerves?

Nothing to clear up, just nonsense 😎

I am not up on the current rules, but years back the grip was evaluated on being strong, full and calm.

That's true, but "calm" in case of not regripping, not changing the grip.

Otherwise the dogs are allowed to "fight" with neck, body, legs -and a lot of people including a lot of judges like this.

Thanks Susie for clarifying that. I love a dog full of fight.

That's true, but "calm" in case of not regripping, not changing the grip.

Otherwise the dogs are allowed to "fight" with neck, body, legs -and a lot of people including a lot of judges like this.

susie so what kind of fight it is, when dog by "full strong grip" hanging on the sleeve like sausage in butcher shop, when another armed hand of opponent approaching that dog with intention to smash dog's head or break the back of that dog?

apple:
With dogs that have defense as their primary drive instead of prey, it is a little bit different, but I don't think those type of dogs are the best for man work.

can you elaborate on that point, why?

Susie, if you say so, I agree with you about points. But I am getting tired of constantly reading and hearing about the desirability of a deep calm bite and foundation work which teaches that.

Prager, dog's deep strong grip won't hurt.
what hurts is when dog do not allowed to have own initiative in how to act during confrontation. in fight, which unlike hunt produces lots of resistance and countermeassures from an opponent, sharp tearing bites to inflict maximum possible harm to opponent are more effective.

@ Susie: Here it is tape and pased from the rule book  

Assessment criteria for defense drive:

 Determination.

 Self-confidence.

 Full, forceful, hard and steady grip

 

the dictionary says about word "steady":

 

stead·y

/ˈstedē/

adjective

1. 1.

   firmly fixed, supported, or balanced; not shaking or moving.

2.  Synonyms

3. synonyms:

   stable, firm, fixed, secure, fast, safe, immovable, unshakable, dependable;  anchored, moored, jammed, rooted, braced "the ladder must be steady" motionless, still, unshaking, static, stationary, unmoving

4. So I'd say shaking is not desired. 

Hans.

Did you highlight the words? If you did, I find it interesting that the only word you left out was motionless because it didn't fit your needs. I could have done the same and only highlighted "firmly fixed". You can't pick and choose which words fit your argument. Susie told you what it is interpreted as.