OCD Puppy Needs to Be Re-homed - Requesting Resources - Seeking older juvenile to 2 Y/O dog. - Page 2

"From my reading, and I read a lot about this, it seems often the best service dogs are found as young adult dogs in the pound. "

A long time ago, before shelters started excusing seriously bad behavior, and before they were flooded with gang-bred Pits, there was some chance of finding a good service dog at a shelter. Now this is the worst possible place you could look for a service dog (or a family dog). No medical history, no behavior history (such as, the owners who gave the dog up failed to mention that the dog tore off a chunk of their toddler's face). The adopt-don't-shop folks don't want you to hear this but it's true.

As for the OP's dog: Ater giving this a lot of thought, I think writing her off as a potential service dog is way premature. I asked my girlfriend what she would do in your situation, and this is what she said, which I agree with 100%.

1. Keep the dog for now and never mind getting another dog for a while.

2. Forget all of this structured activity and just let her be a dog. Not a potential service dog, just a dog for now. That means get her some calmer dog playmates and set up frequent playdates with them. Many of the dogs I train learn far more from my dogs than from me. If she doesn't have high prey drive, a calm but playful dog-friendly cat might be worth adopting so she has an animal buddy at home. (You can still get really nice cats at shelters.)

3. It also means take her for walks just for the fun of it. Take her to the park and sit on a bench with a book or your computer. Welcome the attention from strangers who stop to tell you how pretty she is, and tell her how wonderful she is if she approaches them and lets them pet her. She has been seeing way too many "experts" and not getting out in the real world enough. She doesn't need a big room with lots of toys. She needs to be out in the world.

4. Stop taking her to trainers. You know how to train the basics.

5. If you can do the PT yourself, do it instead of having strangers continue to hurt her.

6. Seriously chill. Much of the dog's anxiety is probably caused by yours.

7. Stop feeling sorry for her! Yeah, she had a rough start but so what? She could have a whole wonderful life ahead of her.

8. Unless she is totally nuts, stop the antidepressants. I am not opposed to using these but they seem to miss the point in this case. And I suspect they are not good for a developing dog's brain. Ditto for the CBD oil--it may be causing some of her anxiety, and it is not good for the brain.

9. Never mind what some asshat wrote about how she can't do public access work. It's way too soon to tell, especially given her circumstances. We are assuming that she doesn't lunge and snarl at people or take chunks out of their legs.

10. Start teaching her some of the hearing dog stuff. You can read directions and you do not need a trainer for this. Sure you'll make some mistakes but everyone does and the dog will learn anyway.

11. See where she's at a year from now. Unless she is genetically unsound--and nothing seems to indicate that she is--I think you'll see a huge difference.

12. For your own gratification, kick the breeder's ass. Never mind a lawsuit, it would cost a fortune even if you win and you likely won't get your attorney's fees back. Never mind the attorney general, they have kids who were raped, babies who were murdered, parents who dropped dead of opiod overdoses in front of their kids, etc to deal with, so ripped off puppy buyers aren't even on their radar. Plus if they did rippped off puppy buyer cases, they wouldn't have time to crap because there are so many of them. The one effective weapon you have is the one you don't want to use, and that is bad publicity. Post the breeder's name with a recap of how you were ripped off here and at ripoffreport.com. Ask for others who have been ripped off by this breeder to post as well. Consistent bad publicity is the best way to drive a bad breeder out of business.

One other thing: rehoming an unspayed dog makes it very likely that she will end up in a puppymill hellhole. It won't matter that she has limited registration. The breeder will just use another dog's AKC papers when she registers your dog's litters.

JonRob? While many on here might flinch at your abrupt personality and abrasive delivery at times, I myself find it very refreshing and indeed respect it. Moreover, all of you make a good point: Just letting her be a dog in and of itself has merit.

The PT is actually not hurting her and in fact is mentally stimulating to her and she appears to enjoy it. Its all floor work etc. cavilettis, down, stays, sit, touch, “puppy squats”... mental and physical directed play. So I will keep doing this for her as this is beneficial. Moreover, I DO, VERY MUCH, love and enjoy who she is. She is WONDERFUL. She is beautiful, intelligent, loyal, smart, loving,....she’s an incredible little being.

I shy away from the social media aspect for several reasons. First, a personal one based on my own ethics. Second, and not unreasonably so, my profession. However, I do see your point. I would like to ask, and anyone chime in either on here on via PM: Would it be appropriate to release the documentation which has been obtained so that anyone moving forward who would choose to purchase from the breeder in the future would be able to make their own determination as to whether the breeder is one they should do business with? Please let me know anyone’s thoughts on this matter. And in particular, the moderators of the forum would be most helpful in letting me know what is and is not professional and acceptable.

"I shy away from the social media aspect for several reasons. First, a personal one based on my own ethics."

Exposing an unethical breeder is the ethical thing to do.

"Second, and not unreasonably so, my profession."

Don't know what that is, so can't comment.

"Would it be appropriate to release the documentation which has been obtained so that anyone moving forward who would choose to purchase from the breeder in the future would be able to make their own determination as to whether the breeder is one they should do business with?"

It would be inappropriate not to do this. If you don't do it, you are essentially covering up for the breeder so he can continue to rip off others and produce more damaged pups.

You cannot be the first person this breeder has ripped off. If others had publicized their bad experiences, you might have found out about them and avoided this breeder.

Thanks for the kind words.

Depends on what your lawyers are saying - if they told you NOT to 'go public' while you are working up a case, then I'd stick with that for a while longer. If OTOH you are no longer thinking of taking it to court OR the attourney did not specify keeping quiet, then yes you could & should let the world know about this set of events; and where better than the Rip Off forum here. Be prepared to possibly get some flak back, though. Breeder may still have 'friends' here.

Are you getting problems with PMs by the way, you just sent me the second duplicated msg in 3 days ?

Thus far no, I am not. I will seek legal counsel as to what recourse I should follow. That is excellent advice. If nothing prevents me from providing the information, then the arguments for doing so have weight and merit.

You are allowed to post the name of the breeder and any personal information that THEY have made public.

As the TOS state no emails or texts allowed.

You may also post the contract you have with the breeder, if any, and, of course, your Vet reports.

As another posted the chances of you getting anything back is so true, or even getting $10 to pay a lawyer are so slim and AKC is not going to do anything to help you and not much to them.  

You mentioned that the breeder is putting everything in a new name and they will just keep doing that and continue on.

Pay back is for you to keep posting the new name.

A few random pieces of info.

There was a case where a dog trainer was successfully sued because he certified a dog as safe in public or something like that, and the dog injured someone. So the "she can't do it" letters from your "experts" may be nothing more than CYA jobs.

If you do post the breeder info, it would also be very helpful to post your dog's pedigree. It could tell us a lot about what you might be able to expect from her as she matures.

Also, you might want to seek legal counsel about possessing CBD oil. Under federal law, its legality is questionable at best. Much useful info here:

https://hightimes.com/news/politics/dea-cbd-oil-is-not-legal-in-all-50-states/

 

JonRob I know of a couple of cases where a dog was "trained" either bought that way or paid for by the owner and the owner went to court and sued and won. Heard of many more. It is much easier to prove a case like this.

I have heard of buyers who have gone to court for a puppy with issues and they won but never heard of anyone getting any kind of real recompense to cover the cost of anything much over the cost of the pup. Again the signed contract will be in play.

Then if the seller has a good signed contract even less. Should the buyer be able to prove that the breeder knowingly bred dogs that would produce issues, not could, then there is a better chance of getting something back but still so little.

And I live in California where they go to court for just about anything.

"JonRob I know of a couple of cases where a dog was "trained" either bought that way or paid for by the owner and the owner went to court and sued and won. Heard of many more. It is much easier to prove a case like this."

Good to know. There are a lot of scammers pawning off so-called "fully trained" dogs with minimal training and sometimes unstable temperaments at outrageous prices. I've seen the aftermath and it's not pretty.

"I have heard of buyers who have gone to court for a puppy with issues and they won but never heard of anyone getting any kind of real recompense to cover the cost of anything much over the cost of the pup."

Sad but true.

The only real recourse is tons of bad publicity. That's where PDB and ripoffreport come in. The puppy owners still won't get decent recompense but at least they can put a real dent in a bad breeder's business if there are enough well documented posts about the problem.

I love Jonrob's girlfriend...

I didn't post cause I have got no personal experience with service dogs, but this woman mentioned everything I thought, too.

Stay away from all those trainers, your girl is a puppy, she needs to live like a puppy, with as much "normal" social input as possible.

Dog reactive? Absolutely normal at that age - guess you are not interested in a sleeping pill but in a normal dog - there is a life besides the "job" - and as far as I understood you may have hearing problems, but no restrictions in movement. So what?

Junk, you bought a puppy in the hope to get a service dog - up to now nothing important changed...and I guess you knew the training will take up to 2 years.

Why are you not willing to give her a chance? You love her, and I am pretty sure in case you give her away you will regret it forever.

All the best, whatever you decide to do.