PANO? Common in German Shepherds? - Page 2

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by JanisNovak on 20 June 2003 - 12:06

We have an 8 month old male with Pano, the first case we've ever had. He (and his littermates) were weaned onto BARF and have been raw fed all their lives. Pano is one of those "Goshdarnit!" things. It's not fatal, it is painful and they WILL grow out of it. It just sucks when there are so few conformation shows and he's limping on the day of the show. All we can do is train around it. On good days he trains and plays, on bad days he's quiet. Non impact exercise, not carrying extra weight and patience are about all that's possible. JDN

by kioanes on 20 June 2003 - 15:06

BARF is not the magic cure to all ills, neither is commercial food the cause of all ills. pano can and does occur in both feeding regimens. i agree with KellyCzaza; but rather than being directly heritable is more about familial growth rates. as in people, some bloodlines (or families) tend to mature faster than others. it's the rapid growth that causes pano.

by Kerry on 20 June 2003 - 15:06

Dr. Billinghurst wrote that in a particular Pano study, 86% of the dogs were GSD and males were 4 times more likely to get it than females. He stated that he felt that GSD were probably not MORE predisposed to Pano, but just that there are more GSDs than other Large Breeds. I'm not an expert, just learning, but since Billinghurst is the leading BARF Guru, I tend to believe him. High levels of protein, calcium and energy (calories) is something that's mentioned as a cause of too rapid growth. Yes, it's gonna happen sometimes, anyway, and OF COURSE right before the only conformation show for months! My own vet cautions about organisms such as campylobacter and salmonella, but really, we've had no problems. A healthy immune system can handle it!

djc

by djc on 20 June 2003 - 15:06

Lots of good info here. Just one thing to add. If you are going to feed a "kibble" diet do NOT feed puppy food for longer than 12 weeks. The manufactured puppy food has all of the ingredience for pano; high protien, calcium, etc that cause fast growth.

by Kerry on 20 June 2003 - 16:06

I very much agree with you that familial growth rates are significant and different between bloodlines. That's why I question feeding the same food in the same amount to different puppies. I know that some breeders and veterinarians are recommending feeding high calorie growth food to puppies until they're a year old. I used to do it, but not any more.

by JanisNovak on 20 June 2003 - 23:06

quote "I know that some breeders and veterinarians are recommending feeding high calorie growth food to puppies until they're a year old. I used to do it, but not any more." endquote I think, in the US, we're just used to seeing fatter dogs and people equate that with "healthy". FAR from the truth, of course. At the same time I was raising my first BARF weaned litter, a friend was raising a kibble fed litter. Three days difference in age. She was CONSTANTLY going on about how big they were, how gorgeous they were, look at the bone, look at this, look at that... mine looked kind of like scrawny little rats! EVERY night I went to bed wondering if I was doing the right thing! Now, after nine months, the young dogs' sizes are virtually identical. On average, mine are about five pounds leaner and look a little more firm and dry, but in general, there's NO discernable difference. And in her litter, she had two males with pano (litter size 12), my litter of 7 has one male with pano. I think it just happens. JDN

by Kerry on 21 June 2003 - 02:06

Good litter management, Janis, and congratulations on a healthy litter. Yes, the roly-poly GSD puppy is not what we want to see. I don't know about your vet, but mine would prefer them not to eat raw poultry. It's interesting how our feeding practices "evolve", but we end up returning to the way that dogs would feed themselves, naturally. Sounds like your litter is a good testimonial to that concept.

by KENNYR on 23 August 2004 - 23:08

I had one once with Pano.It developed at 4 months,I thought it was the hips but they turned out fine. Could barely walk on the hind legs and had no muscle at all there.The vet looked it up and it showed that it was inherited and it could last as long as 16 months and a family took him in for me and let him just lay around in and out the house,feed him normal and when I went to check on him at 15 months he was coming around and then at 16 months he fully recovered,gained muscle mass and turned out to be a beautiful dog. OfAd good and never produced any pups with Pano.

by DKiah on 24 August 2004 - 17:08

Aah pano, been there done that - have all the tshirts -long bone disease, wandering lameness... has a number of names - still the same ugly condition. It is genetic and runs in certain lines, I have evidence of it in my own breeding program - one of the top AKC dogs in the early years is blamed for this condition since he was bred upon so much... he was at the age of 18 months being taken to be PTS because his pano was so debilitating. They changed their minds and nursed him thru it.... of all the orthopedic diseases, it at least goes away.... Have recently heard of a dog crippled into its adult years by pano but I've never seen it do that... suspect maybe HOD or something else.... The 5 minute vet consult says most commonly seen in dogs 6 months - 24 months has been documented in a 2 month old and a 5 year old.... I myself had a dog with it at 5 months and one at 2 1/2 - 3 years.... Have seen it in both males and females. I've tried all the dietary changes (except the BARF) no noticeable difference in symptoms based on type of food consumed. I do feed adult after about 12 weeks and have fed adult all the way thru, never have fat puppies or any age... have different lines now and still seeing it, think if its gonna happen, it's gonna happen... Some of the NSAIDS do give some relief but must be used on a very very limited basis...... I do let them play a little, they are pups - what else can they do... just no overly physical running... etc... It's all about managing it and it's a pain, always happend during a class or a tracking seminar..... I was usually able to predict... se a growth spurt - dog looking really lanky and gawky, just wait for the pano!! I had growing pains as a kid too!! My knees always ached!!

by mike griffin on 25 August 2004 - 21:08

I HAVE BEEN INVOLVED IN THE GERMAN SHEPHERD DOG FOR 24 YEARS, I NEVER HAD A DOG COME DOWN WITH THIS AILMENT, ALTHOUGH I HAVE SEEN HUNDREDS OF OTHER PEOPLES DOGS AFFECTED. I RECENTLY PURCHASED A DOBERMAN, AND guess what, YES HE HAS HAD THIS FOR SEVERAL MONTHS NOE FROM ONE LEG TO THE OTHER, I SWITCHED TO A DIET OF FLINT RIVER ( NUGGETS) AND IT REALLY SEEMED TO HELP HIM QUITE A-BIT. OF COURSE SEVERAL HUNDRED DOLLARS LAYER,( VET VISITS) I THINK THE DIET/EXCECISE PROGRAM PLAYS AS BIG A PART IN THIS AILMENT AS THE DIET.





 


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