by Hired Dog on 15 June 2020 - 14:06
by duke1965 on 16 June 2020 - 00:06
Wow @ apple, your last post kind of sums up why we are where we are with dogs today, people should understand there is a huge difference between correction and abuse
now you can throw around terminology and call it positive punishment, negative reward and all other shahula, but thats all marketing talk
if a dog shows undesired behaviour, its stupid to say, now im going to sweettalk him into different behaviour that suits my feelings better, NO, you just stop unwanted behaviour by pairing it with an unpleasant result for the dog, this is the cleanest way to get result, and it sticks in the brain of the dog ten times faster and stronger
now if people have a problem with level of correction, its to the club members to tell them it is not wanted or even functional to use to much, high or hard corrections, but its stupid to throw away the system at all. or look down at all clubs for the bad behaviour of a few or even a few more
clubs should deal with it inside the club,before it gets to be used by people who want to harm a person, but with doing that are harming the whole KNPV world
by BlackMalinois on 16 June 2020 - 04:06
Apple one of the biggest mistakes in KNPV a lot trainers focus too much on bitework and not control
They make the dog young crazy on bite work and later they they will work on control....and lot of times
its too late because they let the dog grow and conflicts are born.. Then they destroy the dog and take a new one and on and on.
IMO its better to begin with GSD when you start as a green handler KNPV , GSD are mostly better balanced in drives and control, but what happens fresh people start with the craziest X mals bloodlines and the trouble begins.When.... you can find a nice GSD its the perfect dog to start and learn for that long and difficult KNPV programm
by apple on 16 June 2020 - 06:06
by Hired Dog on 16 June 2020 - 08:06
Indeed, a hard correction will shut down any unwanted behavior, like Duke said. Indeed, some dogs need them more then others, but, they ALL need them to proof after training is done.
There are some dogs that are better with a different type of relationship and training style then the 4 pillars you described earlier. Some will do just fine with it.
by apple on 16 June 2020 - 08:06
by Hired Dog on 16 June 2020 - 09:06
Indeed, there are many variables like you mentioned, too many to get into, the subject was the KNPV program.
If I were training a dog for that program, I would select one that could handle the training, be easy to live with and not need so much compulsion that I hate myself daily.
Again, I use prongs and E collars, more E collar the last 10 years then anything else, but, I dont need a dog that needs 3 of them on at the same time to prove to anyone what a bad ass dog he is and what a bad ass handler I am.
Currently, I have the luxury of time with my 8 week old puppy I just got. He will learn at a good pace, the way I want to teach him, with a solid foundation.
The KNPV guys will do what they do, hopefully not get into any legal issues with the State and continue training the dogs they have. It is a great program as a foundation for police work, they just need to lay off killing dogs in the training field.
by apple on 16 June 2020 - 10:06
party who is after KNPV when this recent episode of hidden cameras documented the abusive training leading to the disbanding of several clubs.
by Hired Dog on 16 June 2020 - 13:06
by emoryg on 16 June 2020 - 14:06