Top Breeder Ethics - Reply to Wienerau - Page 3

As I wrote before Jantie, you are free to have your own opinion. But if you blame me for missing ethics, why don¿t you stop hiding behind a nickname?

Saoa, there was NO namecalling whatsoever. You are misleading the readers of this discussion. I have answered to some of the questions which were asked. There was no namecalling involved. I was not insulted or offended by anyone, nor did I offend or insult anyone else. Everybody sticked to the rules, and you are not honouring the Freedom of Speech. Tell the people on this board exactly what was against the rules! I can't see why you don't allow a controversial discussion to take its course. And you're totally ripping apart the thread. Why is that? People all over the world are entitled to read facts. And facts is all I was talking about. It looks like KGB and FBI. This is NOT what people have to accept. Pleade do put the comments back in place. There was no reason to remove them.

By the way, this is the second thread you are ruining. What is your involvement? I'd like to know. Aren't people allowed to have a good discussion? What the free world needs, is NOT a teacher telling us to shut up.

No, breeders are not miracle workers as there are no perfect dogs, but it proves that hips can be EXCELLENT from both parents and you can still come up with bad hips. How can this still be happening? Will HD ever be stamped out? Dawn

"RE: Saoa, there was NO namecalling whatsoever." Yes there was name calling, clearly. I will not repeat it, because then I'm in violation... However, if your memory is that vague than maybe you should re-read your writings before you hit the "submit comment" button next time. You seem to write from emotion instead of facts of life. So, in fact, YOU are ruining the thread yourself... RE: Freedom of Speech, read the terms of service. Its linked below on EVERY PAGE OF THE DATABASE. There are FOUR moderators with access to the site's delete function. I am only one of them, and yes, this time I deleted your commentary where in you slandered a breeder. I don't dance to the tune of anything else BUT the Terms of Service when it comes to this board. And lastly, I'm not here to teach. DAWN: great question. If you find the answer to it, let us all know... my best guess, recessive genetics, just as 2 short coats can produce a litter of long coats, and the same combo's next litter is a litter of short coats...

You got me all confused SAOA. You wrote: "You seem to write from emotion instead of facts of life..." I WAS indeed offering FACTS ONLY! But let me try again and cut my message in different parts. You can then delete whatever you think needs to be censored (or is not appropriate).

To Chris “Silbersee”: Cosmetic issues, as you call them, would not prevent the dog from being “angekört”. For each item one can check what the “penalties” would be, there are well defined rules for this, like for missing teeth for instance. Minor faults would never upset me, but we are talking “total loss” here. Indiana had to be excluded totally from everything.

To Doggy who wrote: “What about meeting in between” I would have been more than happy to meet in between. It’s the total lack of cooperation/interest I detest. I have the greatest respect for all the small breeders doing their utmost for the breed, but I can’t handle being screwed and ignored. You have no idea of the engagement of my daughter and myself to treat and love this dog from the first day we brought him home. “Shit happens” is an unsatisfactory response when talking about his HD.

Ulli wrote: “Like i stated before, to have this kind of discussion on a board like this, will not help anyone, it will only stirr up things.” To Ulli: And stirring up things is just fine with me. All GSD-friends around the world must be informed that Top-Level-Breeders will LET YOU DOWN when your pup has HD. The chances for you receiving an HD-dog are more or less fifty/fifty (which you all know from my studies which I have presented here on many occasions). By the way: You probably missed the other thread: “any info on wildsteiger land litter”. Ulli wrote: “I truly believe that there should have been a solution that would have served both, seller & buyer.” To Ulli: Thank you for your understanding. I was forced to sue the breeder in court for not living up to the many agreements we had made. No solution was offered, total non-communication and threatening: “You will hear from my lawyer!” was what I received. It did not scare me. Ulli wrote: “mseebran, no harm, i agree with you, if someone knowingly breeds 2 breedunworthy animals together, and sells it as top notch animals ....go get him !” To Ulli: The grandmother of my dog: Yanke vom Wildsteiger Land, had four “NZ” in her pups, NOT counting the “bad results” (worse results) that were not sent in, but must certainly have been there. (So she has given bad hips in each litter.) Two of these “NZ” were sisters to Nanda vom Wildsteiger Land, Neta and Nette. Risky business to breed with her, don’t you think? (understatement). Now Nanda delivered (at LEAST) two awful hips in the I-litter (Ice and Indiana). She should never have been used again. I leave it up to you, to go and check the litters she still had afterwards.

Blitzen wrote: “No one I know makes money selling dogs unless they have a harem of brood bitches and an on-going supply of puppies.” To Blitzen: You have NO idea! The kennels I have mentioned before DO have a harem of brood bitches and on-going supplies of puppies. They go to the limits of the SV and breed the rest on secondary kennel names (of spouses, daughters, etc.), not mentioning the “outplacement”. This database might not be entirely consistent with the SV-Genetics, but do go ahead and check how many representatives of the named kennels are here. Can’t breed those figures with two litters a year!