Degenerative Myelopathy and stem cell therapy - Page 2

Blitzen, I understand all that. That's not what I am saying. Sure, you can have clear and carriers in the same litter, but only if you have parents who are carriers. Clears produce clears. So, if you have 2 clears, testing idividual dogs is silly, no? Everyone knows it's in every type (show, working, etc.) but to what degree? I think if people would post something, somewhere, when their dog was diagnosed, it would lend some accountability.

 

One more thing - less than 20% of GSD's diagnosed with DM actually have it when a post mortem is done. Just because an older GSD has a weak rear and drags it feet doesn't necessarily mean it has DM. I believe it was Clemmons who stated that most cases of DM are misdiagnosed by vets. That's why he developed a plethora of tests to insure the right diagnosis is made so a program to try to stave off the disease can be started. It's not possible to positively diagnose DM in a living dog; it's a process of elimination.   Could be spondylitis, arthritis, a tumor, cancer, degenerative disk disease, etc.. Best thing to do if  you suspect your dog has DM is to send a DNA sample to OFA. They say to date every dog with symptoms of DM that was tested turned out to be at risk, so that is a good barometer I think.

If the sire and the dam are both normal, you will only get normal puppies. You would not need to test each puppy individually. OFA will probably sooner or later recognize a dog that is clear by parentage, but for only one generation. Sure the ideal scenario would be to begin with 2 normals and continue to breed only to normals. Most are not going to be that lucky but that doesn't mean they should not breed their dogs. There is no way to determine the "degree" of DM in specific lines because it is evenly distributed throughout the entire breed both in show and working lines. No single line has more or less individuals that have produced DM than others. All showlines go back to the same 25, 30 dogs, not sure about the working lines, but since they too produce DM the same might be said about them.You can always look at the dogs that are already tested, that will give you some idea of who is testing their dogs and the results.

BTW. a clear can produce a carrier if bred to a carrier. If bred to an at risk, a clear will produce all carriers. The only time one can ssume both parents are responsible is if an at risk results.

Shelby is a rescue so I don't know her lineage. Shelby is only around 6 or 7 years old.

She has been DNA tested and the results came back "affected or at risk." 

She had x-rays done and they showed no arthritis or any abnormalities. She has two gunshot pellets in her so doing an MRI is not an option. Doing a Myelogram can be detrimental to a dog with DM so both my regular vet and rehab vet are against having it done. They both trained under Dr. Clemmons and are both certain Shelby has DM.

Breeders- PLEASE test your dogs!!!! I know many on here already do and kudos to you!

 

I am so sorry that your girl has DM. Stem cell therapy seems to work miracles for dogs. I hope it helps her. 

Good luck to you.

I have a slightly different take than many on DM.

I had an incredible dog die of DM at 12y 11m.  He was diagnosed on about his 12th birthday.  Many around me, uncomfortable with the implications, encouraged me to put him down "for his sake."  Well, my brave boy went on for 11m and I watched him lose proprioception and bowel control, yet he never lost his taste for life.  I hovered, not wanting to cause any suffering, but the truth is that he enjoyed his life until he finally lost all control of his rear.  On that day, I took the day off from work, carried him from the car to the river, watched him relax happily in the weightlessness, carried him home and called the vet.  He really didn't suffer very much at all.  I am so glad I gave him the 11m and did not let fussy, avoidant types talk me into putting him down before it was absolutely necessary.

My male now that I have that has DM is from German Showlines. I have done the DNA test thru OFA and he did come back as "At Risk".  Aiko was diagnosed about 2 months ago with DM. He was showing the clinical signs, so I took him to the vet and my vet said she was almost certain it was DM. So I did the test thru OFA. I am following the protocal from Dr. Clemmons. I have started Aiko on the supplements that are recommended. I do not have him on all of them yet, as I do not want to introduce them to fast. I have not started the medications that are recommended yet.

I also DNA tested my female and she is a CARRIER. She is mostly Czech with a small amount of West German workinglines. She is the one in my avitar. I will only breed her to a CLEAR male. 

I have been doing some research myself and I have noticed that most of the dogs that are AFFECTED or AT RISK are either German showlines or American lines. I have not seen any Affected or At Risk from Czech, Slovak, WG working lines or DDR. I am sure there are some that have DM, but I personally have not seen any.  As for the CARRIERS I have noticed that most of them are either Czech or WG working. Alot of the DDR dogs I have seen that are tested have come back as CLEAR. As well the old style Czech dogs I have seen alot of them as CLEAR also.

I also would like say KUDOS to the breeders that DM test their dogs. This is a horrible disease. I have to agree though, it is more painful for the owners. Still I hate to see my dog going thru this. I know his time is limited with me and I am going to make him as comfortable as possible and enjoy him while he is here.

Here is the link to OFA if you are interested in doing the DNA test for DM. It is a cheek swab test.
https://secure.offa.org/Cart.html

JVL, thank you for the link to OFA.  I will order the test to day.  As an FYI, Libby is mainly American Lines.

C

Forgot to ask, are they bone marrow stem cells you are using?

here's a video of the follow up neuro exam for the dog in the original film http://dl.dropbox.com/u/14310853/Riley%20Herman%20May%2010.mov

Again, good luck! let us know what happens.