Titans of the GSD World Pass Without Notice like stones dropping in a pond now days - Page 1

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by Klossbruhe on 19 February 2022 - 13:02

Perhaps because I am getting old or perhaps the times have changed and no one on this board seems to care or has the time to care, because not even a moment's notice is taken anymore of the passing of people who have played an important role in the world of German Shepherd Dogs. The last time I remember anyone even being interested was when the great breeder Karl Fuller (vom Kirschental) passed away in 2012...

When the influential pioneering trainer Gottfried Dildei died a year of two ago, I posted and there was little or no response. When one of the most important breeders of the past 50 years Hans Peter Rieker (von Bad Boll) passed last year, I posted and there was no response. In the past 2 months the important Italian breeder Luciano Mussolino (kennel d' Ulmental) and Clemens Lux Executive Director of the SV for more than 30 years died. Their contributions to our breed were significant.

Addio per sempre, auf nimmer Wiedersehen, adieu pour toujours, adiós para siempre. Yes, sadly, it is goodbye forever. You will be missed.

by GSDHeritage on 19 February 2022 - 13:02

by Diamondgal on 19 February 2022 - 19:02

I had vom Kirschental bloodlines back in the day.

by Klossbruhe on 19 February 2022 - 20:02

While I did not know Karl Fuller personally, I knew Oscar Durr (von der Bildeiche), who as at the time was a sub breeder who worked with Karl. Back in the day, I had a nice female out of Cito vom Kirschental. And in our club we had Cardi vom Kirschental and also Wessie and Waike. Very, very nice females.

I was able to go to one of Dildei's seminars in Florida and owned most of his very useful videos.

Rieker was my friend and gave me the chance to handle Atlas and Natan Bad Boll at club shows when they were  young.

. Lux I met on a couple of occasions but could not say I knew him, but he certainly worked tirelessly for the GSD..


by TIG on 21 February 2022 - 00:02

Thank you Kloss for posting this. I am sad to hear it.

I did not see your previous posts because I hardly come to this site anymore for a variety of reasons. 

I know the SV sometimes publishes memorials on their site or in the magazine (that one in german only unfortunately). Could you copy and paste them with a translation?

Also could you talk about some of their more well known dogs and what went into their breeding and their strengths & weakness. Also for the ones you knew personally , did they have favorites. In the herding world at trials if you get talking to some of the good old boys they'll tell you not about their trial dog but the ranch dog back home who is the real deal. Over the decades I have seen the like especially in bitches. The real producer may not be the show dog but her sister at home.

I love studying the breedings these old brewmasters planned. I believe you can learn much by studying them. I wish more of them had been / would be interviewed.

Do you know anything of the breeder behind behind zwinger von Gelben rühl. My understanding is his breeding goal was the admirable a V on both ends and that he had consistent success with that. His breedings are an interesting choreographed ballet between hi-lines and working lines and always maintaining the link back to the von Bugalow and Scipio dogs that were his foundation.

My personal favorite is V rated Enschi Sch3 Ipo3 . https://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=78654-enschi-vom-gelben-ruhl?_v=20121019223949 I would have loved to own a puppy from her but did not discover this kennel soon enough. I also liked the fact that he maintained the tradition of putting 3's on his breeding bitches.

Again thank you for bringing this to our attention. May they all R.I. P. and his brightness & glory.


by Hundmutter on 21 February 2022 - 12:02

I was aware of Luciano's Mussalino's passing because it was all over Groups on Facebook that I belong to. Obviously it is a shame & sad, but I had / have no comment to make because I knew nothing of him. I am sure many British breeders and exhibitors, especially those with Italian dogs, will have regretted his passing - but they no longer use PDB as a communications channel.

Herr Dildei I myself missed out on at the time, because I didn't hear about his death until quite a few weeks later. I never met the guy but from what I had heard about him, this was a very sad loss to the breed as a whole.

by Klossbruhe on 21 February 2022 - 13:02

Hundmutter--The SV website posted obits of both Lux and Mussalino. Not everyone goes to their website, so I posted the news here. I have been here so long, I think most of the type of members who would have been interested are either long gone or no longer visit here...

TIG I could post the translations of the tributes but you can simply go to their website copy the tribute and then use Google Translate. If that does not work for you, let me know and I will post here, but I think their tributes are more detailed than most people would want to know about.

I am sorry but I cannot tell you much about vom Gelben Ruhl, and the breeder no longer active. I think. You probably know more than me. The breeder had a moderate amount of success judging from show and SchH trial results. I agree Enschi was a very nice female.

You ask if I could talk about some of the more well known dogs and what went into their breeding and their strengths & weakness and so on. Unfortunately, this is a subject for a book or at least an article rather than an email. But you make some salient points. As far as show lines go, the best show dogs are frequently not the producers of the best dogs. Case in point Perla and Palme vom Wildsteiger Land. Perla went VA1, Palme never went VA anywhere. Which one produced better?

Breeding remains an art and not a science. You can breed a Sieger to a Siegerin and still not get the result you might think. Consider Quando v Arminius and Pischa v Bad Boll. What great dogs did they produce? The best was Natan v Bad Boll. However, with Quando's son VA2 Odin Tannemeise Pischa did produce a siegerin, Chipsi Bad Boll. I once asked Rieker why he never repeated the breeding which produced the sieger Rikkor and he told me it was extremely rare to get the same quality litter twice. And he certainly bred enough litters over 50 years to know what he was talking about.

As for the working lines...many will tell you that it is possible to breed for temperament which is primarily what working lines breeders are interested in. But the jury is surely out on this. Some of the best working lines breeders will tell you the same thing Rieker told me. Sometimes you get a result, sometimes not. Personally, I think you stand a better chance breeding for structure and color than you do for temperatment.

I am sorry, but I can tell you very little about the best herding dogs. But interestingly, the great Karl Fuller was one of the few herding specialists who also bred for beauty and conformation. And he even bred a sieger, Eiko but he had to go Uran Wildsteiger Land and his own Xitta who was a Lasso daughter to get Eiko.

One thing I think you can breed for is health. This is something which the SV finally got interested in when the GSD was considered the number one breed afflicted by HD. And hats off to them, they have made great strides in this direction. Sadly, other national clubs such as the GSDCA have not taken the same steps in this direction.

by ShermanRanch on 28 February 2022 - 18:02

I doubt the lack of reply was any disrespect. I know I am not on this board often and didn't ever see the posts. Maybe I am too old to know of these Italians but feel for the families and friends of anyone who has passed on. The previous mentioned men as well, sympathy for those loved ones remaining. It is hard to lose our loved ones. I have met both and learned much from Gottfried Dildei" and others away back when they were young men and women too. I think Mr Dildei was one of the more personable less egopuffed trainers I have met who welcomed newbies who ask silly questions and respected dogs as individuals. forget hearing about the pedigree or past luggage mentality and train bond work with THAT particular dog. I loved that. Time on earth is temporary. Enjoy the ride.

by Klossbruhe on 01 March 2022 - 01:03

Yes, Gottfried was patient and an all around nice guy especially for someone who had enjoyed so much success in high levels of competition.

As an oldster myself what I was getting at was more in the nature of autre temps autre moeurs. Yes, all things pass, but to take a moments notice does not take much. But perhaps it is simply that the people who knew those men are no longer with us either.

Baerenfangs Erbe

by Baerenfangs Erbe on 01 March 2022 - 15:03

Another reason is that a lot of Germans are very private people. My dad didn't want the commotion around his name when he passed. He didn't even have a facebook account, nor did he want any pictures online etc.

So yeah, a lot of people just want their immediate family involved rather than an online spectacle.


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