Help: Aggression. - Page 1

Pedigree Database

Premium classified

This is a placeholder text
Group text

Premium classified

This is a placeholder text
Group text

Premium classified

This is a placeholder text
Group text

Premium classified

This is a placeholder text
Group text

by lewis88 on 30 December 2008 - 14:12

I would like to start this by asking all of you for some respect regarding this subject. I understand it is likely very easy to critisize me however, I came to this site seeking help and advice, not to be chastised.
If you have something rude to say, please pm me and I will be happy to reply.

 

I have 3 dogs:

2 GSD (male 20 months, female 4 years)

1 Shiba Inu (female 6 years)

All of my dogs are wonderful, I love them very much. In our home they are treated as if they were royalty, they eat the best of food, get routine trips to the pet store for new toys, vet care whenever it is needed....etc.  Usually they get vigorous excersise at least 3 times a week(vigorous meaning, running in the field after a ball for an hour) and get daily walks and runs in the yard.  Since it has been so cold where I am, neither the dogs or myself like to be out for longer then 10 minutes. That being said....as of late, they have not had adequate excersise.

As far as training goes:

The female GSD is very well trained and has completed her CD, she is a wonderful dog and very easy to live with. The Shiba....well she just kind of does as she pleases. We are fine with that and love her regardless. As for the boy.....so far he has completed a basic OB class. He is great around the house (most of the time) but as soon as he is outside, everything he has learnt goes out the window and he behaves as if he is a raving beast.

As a whole, I would like to think we have a pretty good thing going with our dogs. We are very happy with them and would not trade them for the world.

The problem we are having is with Drake (male GS). He has always been aggressive.....since he was 6 months old.
It started with growiling at strangers and before I could correct the situation it escalated into full fledge lunging, complete with bark snapping and nails digging into the ground.  At that point I knew I needed to seek proffesional help.  I contacted the behaviourist at my local shelter and had her evaluate Drake. After an hour or so she told me that she could not help me. She said she doubted if anyone could help and we would likely have to medicate him or have him PTS.

We could never, ever put our beloved Drake to sleep. Not ever.

We looked at our options and sought out many trainers, every last one of them refused to work with us as Drake was beyond there capabilities. Months went by before we found someone who would give him a shot. 

He completed a private OB course (after trying to bite the trainer...) in the period of 2 months. It was very costly and while Drake was able to do his commands with a strange woman around,  I dont feel it has helped his aggression at all.
He was a bit shy of 18 months when the training was complete. For the past 2 months things have been really good with him. He is listening better and much more well mannered.

Drake has NEVER shown aggression towards me, my fiance, or our 2 dogs. He was always so gentle and good natured, never so much as growled at the other dogs. Yesterday was a different story all together.

I was sitting at the computer with my dogs scattered at my feet. Everything had been fine all morning, very peaceful.
I got caught up in an article and my attention sort of...gave in?
The 2 shepherds took advantage of the situation and went into the porch to gorge themselves on a bag of dog food my fiance forgot on the ground (usually the porch door is closed so we dont even have to put the bag up). I heard my female GSD growling and began to walk towards the porch. Before I could make it, Drake attacked her. 
I yelled at him to stop and he wouldnt. My girl was pinned to the ground screaming. I didnt know what to do, all I knew was that I had to get him off of her (


by lewis88 on 30 December 2008 - 14:12

 I had to get him off of her (he is 100lbs, she is 55lbs). He wouldnt stop when I corrected him, so I tried to rip him off of her. I was yelling the entire time .  I could not for the life of me get him off of her, so I whacked him in the shoulder. He didnt stop...didnt bat an eyelash(at this point I was bawling hysterically, as I have never hit my dogs before...ever.). I whacked him again, this time in the head. He got off of her and came at me. He was growling and trying to jump at me. I grabbed him by the cheeks to prevent getting bit (at this point he was thrashing and very PO'd, if he would have gotten free I have no doubt he would have mauled me.)

I held on to him until he calmed down (stood still) when he was okay, and not frantic, I gave him the down command. He listened.  At that point I told him crate, he went in. No protesting...nothing.
While I was closing the crate he began to growl at me in a very deep low growl. Then to my surprise, he pointed at me (like a hunting dog).


After that ordeal I was pretty much in shock. He has never tried to hurt anyone in the pack.

After a few hours I let him outside to potty then let him in the house. He seemed back to his old self. Happy, flying around like a bat out of hell, flinging toys at everyone....

Then my girl went to get a drink of water, out of the blue Drake walked over and grabbed her by the neck.
I ran over and grabbed him. He tried to attack me yet again (I say attack because it was not just a simple "snap" or "bite"). I managed to keep him away from my face and when it was clear to me that this dog meant me harm, I slammed him up against the wall and ran to the bedroom.  I quickly tore up a pillow sham into one long strip so that I could make a muzzle.
I opened my door and there he was. Growling like a beast from hell, inching towards me ready to strike.
He jumped at me again, I caught him by the cheeks and quickly wrapped the fabric around his face to make a muzzle.
That REALLY ticked him off. He began thrashing around, growling and trying to jump on me. After a huge struggle, I managed to make it to the crate.  He went in without protest and the fabric muzzle fell off his face.

He stayed in his crate until my fiance got home.

When supper time came he got let out of the crate. I fed him very slowly....making him do a set of commands for a couple of kernels. I made sure that I handled every piece of food he ate.
He got to stay out of his crate after that and we had no issue's.

This morning I figured it was a new day and everything would be fine.

Thats not the case.

I let them out to pee and let them back inside.
I was going to crate them and go back to sleep. I put my girl away and was going to put Drake away, until I dropped my ciggerette beside the kennel. I bent down to pick it up and of course......I hear growling.
I turned around and sure enough he was sitting in front of me looking at me as if I was his Arch Enemy.  He was giving me a low deep growl and inching closer. Good thing I knew what to expect, or I would have gotten bit.  He lunged at me. I grabbe d him by the neck and held him until he was somewhat calm. Gave the down command. Then the crate command.
I walked away, then immediately felt like a coward.
I grabbed the muzzle, let him out of the crate, muzzled him and then leashed him to my torso.
I did a bit of OB, he had no problem with that and reacted fast. However, just walking around was a different story. He tried to attack me twice already this morning for seemingly no reason.
 
I do not know what to do.  He cannot live with a muzzle attached to his face, but I fear what will happen if I take it off.
He looks at me in an entirely different way....it's as if Im a total stranger invading his space.


missbeeb

by missbeeb on 30 December 2008 - 14:12

Lewis88, I'm not sure what to say to you really.  He's tried to attack you several times... and failed to get even one nip in?

 


Liebe

by Liebe on 30 December 2008 - 14:12

I really feel for you.  I am not experienced enough to advise on the aggression in details, however it is very unusual for a GSD to turn on his owner, and I feel you should get him health checked just to rule out any abnormal issues.  I heard of something similar with a lab and it turned out it had a tumour which was affecting its behaviour.

As for the lack of exercise, can I suggest you invest in a treadmill, yes its boring but as its often been demonstrated that it is an ideal way to take the excess off a dog prior to working with it.


snajper69

by snajper69 on 30 December 2008 - 14:12

Where are you located? You have to keep in mind is hard if not impossible to evaluate the dog based on your description. First mistake "our dogs are treated like royalties" or "she dose as she please" well that's your problem, dog's need structure, bad behaviors need to be corrected as soon as the come out, sometimes for some dogs (sounds like your male GSD) he needs hard correction, the type "he should feel like his life is coming to the end".  Dogs need structure; they need leaders to correct them. What kind of trainers did you use? Are they the kind of "pets mart" quality? Did you try to locate a local GSD or SCH club? They might be of help. GSD is a special breed it needs at times an experience and well verse trainer. Some times it just need a place to explode (protection training) to solve a lot of issues, teach him control and trust in him. I always believe the aggression comes from (if not from poor breeding) lack of leadership and trust in you, dog will take upon him self to step up to the plate. Bed socialization might be a problem. Putting dog to sleep is not always the right solution, it is easier though, unless the dog is really hopeless you should avoid it, good trainer will help here. If you give as your location some people might suggest good trainer that knows GSD and how to deal with him, his opinion might be of more value than the trainers you seen to date.  I am glad you are not giveing up :)


AmbiiGSD

by AmbiiGSD on 30 December 2008 - 14:12

Sudden unexpected aggression towards pack and people the dog is familiar with, can be symptomatic of a brain tumour.


snajper69

by snajper69 on 30 December 2008 - 14:12

It's not that unusual :) you just don't here about it :). I knew of quite few GSD in my life that turn on their owners. Not as many as some other breeds but it dose happens. Most of the time it was caused by bad handling, or the dog being just so dominant that the owner could not handle him. But it dose happen.


tigermouse

by tigermouse on 30 December 2008 - 14:12

sorry but that is a one way trip to the vet IMO PLEASE for your own safety have him PTS !!!!

you are not only putting yourself in danger but your family and friends.

I know its hard but I honestly cant see another option

get him evaluated by a Top trainer if you wish but i fear he will say the same:(

sometimes illness can trigger such events so perhaps a trip to the vets for some tests??

I Feel soooo sorry for you , and i know its hard but sometimes the right decisions are the hardest.


missbeeb

by missbeeb on 30 December 2008 - 14:12

The only one I've heard of did have a brain tumour, he attacked twice, the first time he hurt his owner, (a male) bruised him, the second time, he nearly killed the guy!  It was the surgeon that put him back together again that first suggested a brain tumour... he was right!

What I'm confused about is the "attacking" with no damage, (no offense) is that likely?  I had a lady come to club years ago telling me her dog was attacking her... he was bossing her a little but all in play mode... she rehomed him anyway... probably best for the dog!


snajper69

by snajper69 on 30 December 2008 - 14:12

I agree evaluate him but by a top trainer, someone that deals with working dogs, not a petsmart or toy trainer dogs, they will give you honest opinion on him. If any of them will tell you that the dog is trouble, put him to sleep end of story. Expert opinion is the one that you should listen to not your heart. GSD is a strong dog you won't stand a chance if he really try to hurt you. You just can't take that kind of risk.






 


Contact information  Disclaimer  Privacy Statement  Copyright Information  Terms of Service  Cookie policy  ↑ Back to top