German Shepherd dog

My advice is do not buy a dog unless you can actually go and work with the dog yourself first.

I think that is a pretty basic requirement.  Those high priced 'protection' dogs are just ridiculus.

Bruce

Bill Jenkins, www.texomak-9.com  located in southern Oklahoma.

Why don't you buy a young, green dog and take it to training yourself? The dog will have a stronger bond with you and be much more likely to actually defend you.

You'd better start writing police departments Brittany to let them know they don't need those dogs.  They just need bigger guns and more work on their wrestling moves.

MI_GSD,
I just got up from a nap and I read your post and was discombobulate. What does Police officers having K9s have to do with regular citizens buying expensive personal protection dogs?

Uglydog,

How the hell are ya?    I haven't seen ya post in a while.  

I prefer #4 buck in my riot gun.  

Nice to see your still around.

Brittany-  Believe it or not there are SOME not many but SOME regular people who have a real need for that extra added protection or peace of mind knowing they have a dog that will protect or at least do his damnest to protect his family if a serious situation came into place.  I have all the security you can imagine, cameras, security system, privacy fences, and 3 dogs.  If you've come to do harm and none of the above was enough to deter you or at least make you think twice about doing something crazy THEN we resort to the firearms.  Someone crazy enough to attack with a weapon such as a pipe or what not will do just as much damage to me as he could to my dogs.  IMO I think the dog would stand a better chance at defeat than I would in that case.  A dog can over power the largest of men, they know where to target the body to at least disesemble you for a moment; a human may not be so lucky to have that opportunity.

And quite honestly a good PP dog doesn't necessarily mean you need to take out a second mortgage IF you know who to deal with and where to go to not get ripped off.  All those fancy high priced ads and dogs are a JOKE IMO; just some "business person" banking on a high roller unschooled to come by and think that because he cut a check for 10's of thousands of dollars he got himself some killer security dog til someone who knows better comes along to break the news to him that he just bought himself a very expensive love muffin.

I'm a firm believer that a good dog well trained can be more than effective security and peace of mind than one would need BUT how many people really find themselves in a situation that is serious enough to go through the B.S. in not only investing in that type of security but then taking the time to get trained themselves to learn how to use it effectively???  It's not a security system you go to Sam's to buy, stick it on the shelf and leave it set for "just in case" but if necessary to have is well worth the investment and time.  I've established a new love and respect for these working dogs that I never would have taken the time to understand had I not been placed in a situation that forced me to invest in that type of protection.  I sleep VERY soundly at night, I worry about NOTHING when I need to go anywhere alone after dusk; I know my dogs will sense and hear anything unsualy to alert me in enough time to react accordingly.  Sometimes that is all you need.  Maybe it's a psychological thing???

People get jipped trying to buy a "personal protection dog" quite often it seems. We see stuff on here by unhappy buyers alot.
If you buy a personal protection dog and it comes out of the crate calm, wouldn't you think something was wrong? If the dog hasn't worked WITH you, then he's going to see YOU as a threat just as much as anyone else because he doesn't know you. Thus a TRUE personal protection dog you haven't spent any time with but purchased from another country or breeder/trainer WOULDN'T LET YOU LET HIM OUTTA THE CRATE. Common sense. He'd eat you alive just like you're wanting him to do to potential threatening strangers.

I fully agree with getting a dog who's past the puppy stages but still a juvenile (maybe 12mos old), bond with the dog 24/7, and start going to a good class YOURSELF after you and the new dog have a couple of weeks to get to know each other. Learn WITH your dog how to handle, control, and appreciate your dog.

German Shepherd Dogs by and large are NATURAL protectors. They don't need a bunch of expensive training for it. It's supposed to be built in. If you want a 'tougher' dog, go for working lines. Full West German Show lines don't usually produce ideal protection candidates-they're usually smooth and easier-going from what I've seen. But, there are exceptions to ANY rules.

I have a 16 mos old black female who has not had ANY personal protection training laying here in my front room with the kids-- if you came into my home uninvited, she would quickly convince you it was a very bad idea. She's not even fully mature, and she's not a male. She's my girl and she knows it, and our bond is tight. No training needed.

hate to go on a rant but,

 how many of you have been in a HIGH stress shoot? barring fellow military persons or police officers i'd venture to say none. my wife is an exceptional shot at the range! would i trust her under a breakin/ robbery shooting in my house with my children in their rooms? hell no! ! ! i  would  trust my dogs to protect her and my kids though. if the would be robber has a silenced .22 or any other ''silenced'' handgun and kills my dog well my wife will have my shotgun and whatever happens at that point happens! but he was a determined induvidual and not your ''average'' home invader/burgalar. then again i don't have enough money to warrant such an invader coming to visit my house. most home invaders are looking for the ''easy'' target. like said by ramage, a loud dog making racket will probably deter them to the easier house down the street without a dog.  also like agar said a protection dog is a very nice piece  of mind, i feel my family is pretty secure while i'm away on training or deployment, then again i now own a 4pack of dogs!

sincerely kenny

Opps,

got cut off.      Mike and the mechanics, silent running.    It popped into my head as I was reading your post..LOL

"If you buy a personal protection dog and it comes out of the crate calm, wouldn't you think something was wrong?"  ABSOLUTELY NOT! I think if he came out growling, snarling or trying to eat the wire to get at me is when I'd say I'm thinking "self, there is DEFINATELY something not good about this picture".  I think you may have a TOTAL misconception of what a GOOD pp dog or any other for that matter should be like.  A stable clear headed dog who is confident will most certainly be calm coming out of the crate.  Those make the BEST pp, police k9's as they are thinkers, will not likely react on impulse, or take a bite out of fear or unjust provocation.

"If the dog hasn't worked WITH you, then he's going to see YOU as a threat just as much as anyone else because he doesn't know you." A dog that has been trained weather it be for sport, police or pp knows the difference in a threat or not regardless if it is of a stranger or not;it's something that is taught/shown If you're statement was at all accurate we'd sure have a problem with all those police k9 handlers walking the streets with dogs trying to bite little old ladies standing at the bus stop. 

"Thus a TRUE personal protection dog you haven't spent any time with but purchased from another country or breeder/trainer WOULDN'T LET YOU LET HIM OUTTA THE CRATE"  I'm not sure what breeders or trainers you've dealt with that would sell anyone a dog that the buyer could not take out of the crate unless you requested a maneater; in that case you did not buy a pp dog but a liability.

If you've ever had an opportunity to own/train a really good clear headed, solid nerved pp dog I think you will find a new appreciation for their intelligence and loyalty.  I own 3 pp dogs, none have ever been what you described but quite the contrary.

I'm sorry ts34 but those video's did not impress me in the least.  The dog didn't alert to the camera man in the bush's, he didn't bark on the trail until the man started saying stay back, the dog didn't show any real interest in the child when being patted, and the guy actually had to lay hands on the kid to get a responce only after waving his arms and no sound to show what was said.  The home invader would have shot anything in his path coming through the door and the dog only went for the sleeve.   It was too staged and not convincing in the least.      What would the dog have done if it were kids, say 10 or 11 who had walked over to the smaller child?    The only thing that made sense is a stalker on a path would not walk up to say a woman who was walking any big dog unless he was prepared to take the dog out.   And how would the playground scene have played out in a real park with lots of kids and parents?  

I'm glad my dogs are not trained in this manner.   Mine would bark before the guy got to the door, and mine can be trusted around anyone, just don't grab my kid or wife because the dog would sense they're fear and distress and take someone to the ground probably from the thigh or chest.  My dog would definately see or smell or hear the camera man in the bush's long before we got close.  

I'm sure there are better PPD dogs out there than this.   Keep surfing that U-tube.

I agree with you Agar.

Lets be honest

A trained PP dog,  is simply One added layer or barrier,  in any protection scenario. They are also a visible threat to anyone intent on harming you.

They are often Not adequate,  in & of themselves, depending on the attacker & his intent.

Ive personally pepper sprayed large, charging dogs  intent on harming me,  while bike riding in the country, protecting myself & as a last resort.  It Works & will immediatly  disable any Dog or Bear, for that matter.   $10 Pepper spray.

Dogs are great alarms & guards.   But one should never put blind trust in any protection system, that is a canine. They are too easy to overcome, for a determined attacker.   A Pipe, Knife or .22 to the head.   And then they come for you.  Average thug, perhaps not. It depends on ones security needs.

If you think 911 will save you, your nuts.  5-20 minute response time for most Depts.   Same goes for a camera, fence et al.  Nice to have after the fact. 

I dont discount dogs as a defense in a system. But neither will say that a dog is all one needs.

Get a gun or guns, learn to properly shoot.  Go hunting.  Learn about adrenaline.

Theres Nothing like a 300lb wild boar charging you,  to gain experience &  practice any real life scenario with adrenaline.

Been there, done that.

Hi Ugly,

You ever have any interest in laser's?    just curious.    My eye sight is not what it once was and I have had several over the years. 

2 moons...  I make my living with my eyes..  Eyesight is not bad, though I wear corrective lenses.

Ive never had lasers on any arms.   My shooting is good, not great, but  good enough that Ive hunted & killed many gamebirds, waterfowl,  deer, boar & small game over the years, & every year for the past 25 Ive hunted..   Shooting is an art as well as a science, especially if your shots are longer ones.  My aim is generally steady & excellent at close range( inside 300 yards).

AGAR-much as I love GSDs, the few Ive owned were great dogs, Im not  sure the wife could live with the hair-shes a picky "princess".  We are working out "an arrangement" presently for the "possibility" of me bringing home another dog.    I will say, that A wirecoated dog, like a Riesenschnauzer (Giant Schnazuer) or Bouvier is a dream far as shedding goes in comparison to a Shepherd,  though the hair  thing never really bothered me too much.  If we get a GSD, it wil probably be outdoors or confined to 1-2 rooms in our home.  

Like many smart men, I need to pick my battles with my wife, & Im not sure if this is one I'll win & regret or not.

Agar,

Something I've always seen with my dogs going back to when the kids were baby's is they sense a child's vulnerability and naturally seem to want to protect them, watch over them, and put up with them.   My oldest boy had a very special relationship with a male I had at the time.  Just like you mentioned with your daughter, the same kind of things.   And my younger boy had a female at the right time who would watch over him as if he was her own pup.  Devoted comes to mind.

I think all my dogs have had more devotion to the kids than to me until the last few years and the kids are grown up and gone most of the time.  I can't say it's only the shepherd that does this either, but they are good at it.   And yes you have to train your dog to the task to have any confidence.  And I agree some dogs may lack the courage to actually give their life in defense of someone.   I think the reason some people get the wrong idea about protection trained dogs is their owners.

I imagine you can understand what I mean without me going into specific's.   I'm in a rush because its time to take care of other business outside.

Catah ya later.

Kenny- That is the story of my life listening to people tell me how nutts I am over my dogs.  Unless you are a "dog person" you really can't relate to the "sickness" we have. lol  It sounds like you have yourself a real nice dog.  What bloodlines is he from if you don't mind me asking.  Mine are mostly czech dogs with a little east german in there to give a nice blend. lol

Uglydog- I take it your wife is not a "dog person"?? lol  My husband tolerates my dog obsessions but drew the line at the 3rd dog.  Surprisingly I have a pretty good handle on the dog hair and have a nice set up here for them.  There's kennels outside they spend the nicer days in and it keeps the yard still nice, I have crates in the garage for when my bitch is in heat or they are blowing serious coats so that eliminates the fur flying and last but not least I have invested in a dyson, a furminator and a cleaning lady that comes every other week. lol  Maybe if you made a deal with the wife and got her a cleaning lady you MIGHT have a chance on getting the ok on that GSD???  I think all women are "princess'" to some degree, just some are more than others.

Uglydog,

Marriage is a give and take arraingement you must negotiate!!  LOL.    Scaring the wife with geese does not get you any leverage LOL .    That was funny.    

I have dogs in the house and it can be a mess but you dont have to give them run of the whole house, designate area's that are easy to clean up and really the hairs only a problem during shedding phase's, they aren't that bad all the time.

And what woman could resist a little soft puppy with those big brown eyes and that sweet puppy breath.  Tell her you found it at the side of the road and couldn't just leave it there...lol

A good marriage will have its ups and downs how well it thrives depends on the individuals and how well they care for each other, its a slippery slope....  you have about a 50/50 chance these days.

Good luck with it.

katjo74-  so right you are that many come on here stating they got bumped over the head from buying a dog they were told was a total manstopper but when it arrived it had about the courage of a hamster. lol  I think the primary reason this happens more often times than not is a. people will buy a dog sight unseen and just take the word of the seller as gospel b. they themselves aren't really educated enough to know what to look for to determine if the dog "has it" to be a pp dog or they don't understand what the make up of the dog necessarily should be to give them what they think they want.  Most times they don't even really KNOW what they want.  And then there is c. which could be the person who really has not a clue as to what a good pp dog goes for and thinks if they paid $1500-2000 they got a top notch dog at a hellava deal.

I'd be very hesitant to buy anything from anyone I either personally never dealt with or knew someone who dealt with them in the past that can say "yes they are honest and have good dogs".  I tell everyone or anyone who's "looking" or "thinking"  to talk to people who own these types of dogs, find out where they got them and what kind of experience they had.

Puppies are a little different situation since they're a crap shoot anyways, but speaking on the older dogs I myself would be careful and do extensive research before I send money.

I agree, Agar.  People don't know what they're doing, and in like the buying/selling of all sorts of livestock in general (consider the Quarter horse industry-it's full of garbage-things going on, too), I think if they wanna learn something, they go talk to people and get educated. THEN consider a purchase.
Crapshoot pups. lol. I've heard that alot, too. lol. But, I guess its true. You can't eyeball 7- 6wk old pups and typically tell the 'best' protection pup unless maybe the alpha is available-but that one takes an experienced hand and not a novice. Alot changes between 6wks and 6 mos...and 16 mos, and so forth.

SHEP007- I truly hope you are listening close to all this being said-alot of good sound advice is found here for you in response to your question. We are trying to help you keep from making a potential expensive mistake. I would not be focused on buying something overseas-you're not looking at what you're getting and you just don't know what you're getting until you see it at the airport and generally by then, it's yours, period-like it or not. Most overseas breeders don't give guarantees nor refunds unless the dog DIES in transit, and even then you have to be able to prove it wasn't your fault.
1. Get educated on both the breed in general and bloodlines because different bloodlines will generally produce different temperaments, (go to schutzhund clubs, check references, read books, talk with respected breeders, whatever this may take)
2. Find someone reputable (sleep on it and trust your gut-if you're up all night fretting about something or if something doesn't sound right, well, consider it!), and
3. go from there and see what happens.
And who knows--maybe the initial idea will fade in glamour with all we've said and you'll be glad you didn't spend the $.