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ForumsGerman Shepherd Dog > MDR-1 Gene Defect / Ivermectin Sensitivity (Advocate and many more) (13 replies)
MDR-1 Gene Defect / Ivermectin Sensitivity (Advocate and many more) by Liebe on 15 February 2011 - 23:16 |
| It seems like everytime we turn round someone is finding something else wrong with our fabulous breed, some tests seem like a waste of money, but this one is sensible. I heard some time ago that we need to watch which drugs we use on our dogs, and that even the treatment "advocate" can have negative side effects or worse result in death. The MDR-1 Gene Defect doesnt only affect GSDs, but several other breeds including Rough Collies. A friend in collies shared the results of a report done specially for them on MDR-1 which I feel should be shared with the GSD fraternity. The Club Link http://www.roughcolliebreedcouncil.org.uk/drug_sensitivity.html highlights the issues and lists the problem drugs, a further link http://www.roughcolliebreedcouncil.org.uk/RCBC%20-%20MDR1%20Booklet.pdf gives extra information and details of how to test and where. I also found an extra link http://www.wicani.co.uk/mdr1.htm which gives 1 breeders view and experience with the problem. Yes all these links are from rough collies but they are given as they give good information as well as personal experiences, from which we can learn. I feel that we test for other problems in our breed, but that this issue should be highlighted and tested, as the test has the ability to reduce the effects vet treatments could have to our dogs. Its all too often that antibiotics are just handed out like smarties, and with drug companies encouraging vets to promote flea and worm treatments such as Advocate, we as responsible owners and breeders need to be proactive if we are to help our breed. It is worth also noting which other drugs are on the list, they include cancer drugs and those used to treat AF and many others. I will certainly be testing my dogs and will aim to work with my vets should the results show that there is a large number of drugs which need to be avoided should any treatment be necessary. I have approached the laboratory "Laboklin" to see if we can get a cost discount for testing multiple dogs. |
Liebe by mollyandjack on 16 February 2011 - 00:19 |
| Breeds affected by the MDR1 mutation (frequency %) Breed Approximate Frequency Australian Shepherd 50% Australian Shepherd, Mini 50% Border Collie < 5% Collie 70 % English Shepherd 15 % German Shepherd 10 % Herding Breed Cross 10 % Long-haired Whippet 65 % McNab 30 % Mixed Breed 5 % Old English Sheepdog 5 % Shetland Sheepdog 15 % Silken Windhound 30 % http://www.vetmed.wsu.edu/depts-vcpl/breeds.aspx |
mollyandjack by ziegenfarm on 16 February 2011 - 07:05 |
| gene defect???!!!??? hardly! though i am sure that is exactly how the veterinarian world sees it. any dog that can't handle all the chemicals they deem necessary must be defective. even in humans, most doctors consider menstruation and childbirth a medical condition. why? because most of them are male and therefor these conditions are not normal. it all boils down to what sort of measuring stick is being used whether something is normal or not. my comment is not in any way directed toward the o.p. so please don't take offense. pjp |
ziegenfarm by Liebe on 16 February 2011 - 09:29 |
| PJP I do understand your viewpoint but with more dogs being affected by the drugs that come under this sensitivity, then testing IMHO is sensible. At some point in many dogs lives there is a need for antibiotics, if only for a bad cut which is infected or an infection after developing kennel cough. For some animals who develop AF or cancer then other drugs are necessary, and again many of those are included in the MDR-1 sensitivity list. A simple test which shows that these dogs can either (a) have them or (b) cant is much easier. I am personally allergic to penicillin and know first hand how bad it can make me feel, and our dogs cant tell us about the mild side effects, only the bad ones. |
by ziegenfarm on 16 February 2011 - 15:40 |
| liebe, glad you understand my point ;) your being allergic to penicillin does not make you genetically defective any more than dogs who don't tolerate ivermectin. it just irks me that it is being labeled that way....."gene defect." i fully understand the need for meds in the pet kingdom, but calling these animals genetically defective is just wrong. what is defective is the medication that kills the host instead of the parasite. pjp |
by Wildmoor on 16 February 2011 - 17:43 |
The test as been available in the UK for at least 18mth - 2 yrs |
by Liebe on 16 February 2011 - 23:25 |
| What got me more interested was talking to a Collie person who had more 1st hand information on both the issues associated with MDR-1 and her own 1st hand issues. We should have this test linked to the kennel club and have the results published along with the Hips, elbows etc. This will show people who is testing and the accuracy. After all its only now the hip scores are easily checkable that you can see who isnt as honest about the real results. I would be very interested to hear from people who have tested for MDR-1 and how the results have affected the way their vets treat the dogs. |
by JakodaCD OA on 16 February 2011 - 23:58 |
| my aussie is a mutant/mutant for the mdr1 gene. Which means, she carries the gene, she would pass it on to offspring and she is drug sensitive to the list of 'no no drugs'.. I am VERY careful about what goes into her system, and actually have contacted WSU on a couple of occassions with questions regarding certain drugs. I have had my other aussie tested, he's 'normal/normal' and my gsd is also normal/normal. No one gets vacs anymore except for rabies by law:( When I do a rabies, I make sure it's Thimerisol free, and so far knock on wood no problems with the aussie. She's 11 years old now, and has been, thankfully, very healthy the majority of her life. These are a couple of other good 'reads'. www.busteralert.org http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1476-4431.2006.00196.x/abstract The above link was just posted on another gsd board |
by Doppelganger on 17 February 2011 - 00:23 |
| http://www.smoothcollieclub.com/09mdr.htm List of drugs here |
by mollyandjack on 17 February 2011 - 01:50 |
| Liebe, I'm in the US but this has been my experience: I recently took my collie in to a new vet for a dental cleaning. They needed to use anesthesia for the procedure. I provided them with the MDR1 drug sensitivity information and informed them that she needed to be treated as a mutant/mutant for MDR1. Because of this, they told me that they went a completely different route in terms of the drugs they typically use during the procedure. They also used a different kind of pain medication. |
by Liebe on 17 February 2011 - 08:18 |
| Thank you for the information. It shows me how a simple test has prevented inappropriate drugs being used on your dogs. I have a fairly pro active vet here in the UK and as a result he has never suggested some flea/worming treatments for my GSDs but I have heard too frequently about GSDs who are poorly after vaccinations, flea treatments etc., and I am sure that much of this can be prevented by people not seeing this test for an "illness" or other problem such as HD, but as a way of improving the quality of live for our GSDs. After all if a food makes us ill, we dont eat it, but we regularly continue to shove things down our dogs throats or pour them on their necks only stopping when there is a "serious" problem. I dont vaccinate yearly (havent done for some time) and have been lucky as my dogs have been healthy and rarely needed antibiotics, but once I get my test results back I'll be off to the vets to get the results on their system so if the need should arise again I wont need to worry, as they'll be aware before there is a problem. We have the option of getting a link from the Laboklin to the KC for MDR-1 results, and then the information will be recorded on their health database and also printed on progeny registrations, I personally would like this link to be formed as it can only help our breed and dog owners. |
by pod on 17 February 2011 - 10:37 |
| It would be interesting to know how many GSDs have been DNA tested for this, and the bloodlines of the affecteds and carriers. I do remember it being mentioned somewhere that some GSDs found to be affected were not necessarily from the known pedigree population. The initial research for this gene ruled out continental herding breeds as being affected and this tied in with lineage analysis which pinpointed the mutation to an individual collie of working lineage in the UK, in the 1800s. The descent line from this contributed to the formation of show breeds including the Rough Collie, Shetland Sheepdog and Old English Sheepdog, and the breeds descended from these. If there are GSDs with this MDR1 mutation, then it is likely that they have had admixture of Collie lines introduced into their ancestry at some point. The alternative explanation is that an identical mutation has occurred. Seems unlikely. http://www.pnas.org/content/101/32/11725.full.pdf+html |
pod by Lynx on 17 February 2011 - 11:56 |
| Only 10% of GSD can be Ivermectin sensitive? We used Ivermectin for our GSDs treetmant for many years and for many dogs, but have no negative results. Maybe only one bloodline is sensitive, but which one? |
by Liebe on 17 February 2011 - 16:37 |
| Only with testing and publishing of results will the questions above be answered. I have spoken to Laboklin who are one of the know labs testing for MDR-1 in the UK, and have been told that there have been a few affected dogs found as a result of testing. There have been more carriers and even more clear's found. Unfortunately with no link to the Kennel Club, these results are not published and are only given to the vet/owner. |
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