German Shepherd Dog > My Dogs Did Not Come To My Aid :( (132 replies)
by TingiesandTails on 03 August 2012 - 18:30
|Not all GSD's are born protection dogs. There is a lot of them that are just couch potatoes. And why would they attack an old aquaintance? They don't know that your fight wasn't just rough play.|
Training with only positive reinforcement will only teach your dog that they "may" do something, but they don't have to.
You could train commands to actually bite someone, but with only positive reinforcement no dog will actually feel obliged to do so.
by GoAheadBreakIntoMyHouse on 03 August 2012 - 18:32
|Where's the quote button? :)|
"I have a seven year old female here that has not had protection training either sport or police, I guarantee you, if you hit me on my property and she read me as mad or scared....she would bite you!"
THAT'S what I'm talking about!!
by Red Sable on 03 August 2012 - 18:35
|I had a dog once like Gustav's. If my husband or anyone hit me, he would definitely interfere. Some people do not like that in a dog, I do. ;)|
As for your dog, I agree with what Sheesh wrote. My current dog would be the same way, however, if it was a stranger breaking into my house, it would be a much different story.
I'm really sorry for what happened to you. I think that is horrible and no one should have to put up with that. Charge the creep.
by Conspicuous on 03 August 2012 - 18:42
|I don't think any of us can say for certain how a dog would react in that type of situation unless it actually happens.|
Who knows, maybe my dog will surprise me, but I doubt she'd interfere.
by Gigante on 03 August 2012 - 18:44
If you look at the post's here and else where, most people think their dog will defend them to the death in this situation or any other. Not so much in real life. If they knew him that may have been a possible down fall. Want to see the true possibility of your dog protecting you with real fight? Get a muzzle let them get use to it over some days and then have friend they dont know walk in the room unannounced with bad thoughts and energy and see what happens. Dont over do it on them, move forward medium low threading and you can gauge what they might do. So many factors. Dont forget to film it and throw it up for review, plenty of people here with serious dogs. Hopefully they will chime in and voice their opinion as to how they handled that test.
Dont forget you got yourself out. You where the best weapon for the poject!
With no training the best you should hope for in most dogs is basic protection, yellow belt if you will. Bark, lunge, nip.
I get that, good luck on the next test outside of real. :)
by Red Sable on 03 August 2012 - 18:44
|There are lots of little incidents that happen in life, that give a darn good clue.|
Gustav, any pups from you female?
by Gustav on 03 August 2012 - 18:59
|She is retired, 42 pups in four litters(12, 9, 12, 9, ), she never lost a pup. Five of her pups becme police certified, but most went into nice family homes. She was old DDR blood,4-5, on Artus Westhohle.|
by Tihannah on 03 August 2012 - 19:18
|I thought Max was only 2 yrs old? Aren't you a breeder as well?|
by VitoManiac on 03 August 2012 - 19:35
|You keep saying that your dogs "protect" you, well the truth is that they don't and didn't.|
They are merely a deterrent in your case and obviously you should have done some protection training with them if you wanted to be sure that they would do what you require of them. All you did when you "let them know you weren't pleased" was to confuse them. I'm not knocking your dogs as I'm sure they are lovely dogs, they aren't the problem, you are.
I have 3 GSD's, 14 months, 12 months and 6 months and I know all of them will protect me because they've proved it already on the training field and in the case of the older two in reality too.
by GoAheadBreakIntoMyHouse on 03 August 2012 - 19:50
|I thought Max was only 2 yrs old? Aren't you a breeder as well?|
Max is two. I think I said that in my first post. And, yes, I am a "hobby" breeder. Oh boy, here we go.........
by joanro on 03 August 2012 - 19:59
|Goahead....you evil, evil person. The dirty word," breeder," has now branded you! LOL. (just kidding)|
by Detroit SchH on 03 August 2012 - 19:59
|if you are in Michigan, you are lucky. there are many SchH and Police dog trainers here. Look some up and see if they|
want to take on personal protection clients. there are still no guarantees of your dogs' reaction to a real life situation, but
you can increase your odds by teaching the dogs the basics of biting and outting. They may not know it is ok to bite, ever.
Brian Harvery in Hudson, MI has a SchH club and worked with non-sport clients as well. He might be a good place to start.
You learned a good lesson, and you didnt get badly injured or worse. Now you know your dogs are just a deterrent unless
you undertake some serious training. Dont make your decision lightly. Owning dogs that know they are allowed to bite a
human is a HUGE responsibility.
by ronin on 03 August 2012 - 20:04
|Sadly this normal, working lines or not, so don't blame your dogs.|
I'm not as knowledgeable as some of the guys that have replied to your posts, but my experience is perhaps a little unique. As a SGT on a SWAT Team for the last 25yrs I get out of bed at 0300am to go and smash down the doors of scum bags, we run through the house in the dark screaming and literary drag them out of their beds whilstbtheir fighting like f*ck.
We only get asked to do this for your regular murderers, terrorists, psycho nut jobs, our 6 teams are doing this 7 days a week in one form or another; guess what 99% of UNTRAINED DOGS don't protect; pit bulls, Rotts, Malls, Crosses, dogs on horse steriods, drugs, creatine... no.
Cornered dogs with no escape route sometimes bite, and the very old dogs too strangely enough.
Bear in mind some people on here believe their dogs will bite, and they're probably right but very dogs will FIGHT, big difference!
Prepare yourself, prepare your dogs, remember everyone gets lucky now and then.. even the bad guy!
by JON ERIC on 03 August 2012 - 20:23
|I Agree Totally with >SitasMom,<.......In the County I live,in Maryland,the Dogs attacking would have Resulted in a Fine, and a Yearly Dangerous Dog Fee,due in Full to the County Treasurer,in addition to a Possible Law Suit......|
by Red Sable on 03 August 2012 - 20:33
|Not where I live (Canada). The dog is quarantined for 10 days (rabies) and then, nothing. Multiple bites may result in the dog being put down, but, here they prefer not to put the dog down.|
by Melonhead on 03 August 2012 - 20:40
|Before you write that you believe entirely in positive reenforcement, you should do some research and learn that saying no is still a punishment. So you clearly know nothing about operant conditioning and need to do some research like most trainers/owners that claim they are just positive reenforcement. And I agree your dogs should not have acted, you should be the leader of your dogs not depend on them to solve your issues. As far as getting a malinois, that's a bad idea they require real leadership and even if they are trained in protection should know that you are in control when your present.|
by Gigante on 03 August 2012 - 20:48
Boy thays cause to pack your bags. How does one tolerate to live in a a state that prefers to prosecute a dog that would protect itself and its owner in its own home. That dog had every right to injure or kill the man for punching and fighting its owner in its own house. Shame on any jury that would give you a penny for your damage or death. Holy cow Jon, thats amazing.
by rtdmmcintyre on 03 August 2012 - 20:59
the key words are without provocation .
by live4schutzhund on 03 August 2012 - 21:17
One of the first responses to this thread was the correct one.
by Aqua on 03 August 2012 - 21:27
|We've done some very minimal SchH type training with our dogs, enough to teach them the reactions we want whehn we say 'Pass auf". To them, it's fun because it always results in a reward of some kind, treats, or play, or a bite on a sleeve. The end result is that I can say 'Pass auf' to any one of them and they'll go into a bark-and-hold long enough to let me call the police.|
By giving your dogs some obedience training beyond heeling and retrieving you can use them to assist you in tricky situations. And by choosing your friends and associates you can avoid those tricky situations. It's not really fair of you to put the consequences of your life style choices on your pets.