German Shepherd Dog > Nick vom Heilingenbosch (14 replies)
Nick vom Heilingenbosch
by judron55 on 14 March 2012 - 18:26
I've heard that Nick had severe back problems and was possibly not the sire of some of his offspring due to such. I have heard he had major back surgery and wasn't able to mount a bitch. Can this be confirmed?
by Q Man on 14 March 2012 - 19:29
|Maybe you should ask Koos...of "Tiekerhook Kennels"|
by Brandi on 14 March 2012 - 19:56
|Agreed, email Koos and ask him. Always good to get other's opinions as well. If indeed this was true, the truth may not come to light anyway. If he did have such back problems, it is possible the issue was from being worked hard. A.I. could have been used for breeding. I don't believe Koos would have lied about litters, but whose to say others didn't falsify their dog's pedigrees...happens all the time.|
by GSDguy08 on 14 March 2012 - 20:58
|I've been told dogs are sometimes injured in courage tests, , or from just working too hard. Any truth to that? Like a football player who plays for years, his body isn't going to be in top shape years into his career.|
by Ace952 on 14 March 2012 - 21:19
|in the dog world I have learned to be skeptical of everyone.|
by Q Man on 14 March 2012 - 21:40
|A few years ago I did ask Koos about Nick...because I had a Nick son and wanted to know if it was genetic or from working hard and maybe got hurt from Long Bites (Courage Test)...|
At that time Koos told me that he did have surgery on his back but that it was from many hard hits...Compressing the vertebrae and causing problems...I did ask directly if he thought it was genetic...He told me "No"...
I have no reason not to take what he told me as the truth or was it a breeder protecting himself...I thought it was the truth...
I love the Nick lines but knowing what I do about his bloodlines...I'd prefer having them farther back in the pedigree...
by alaman on 14 March 2012 - 22:18
|I've got a granddaughter and she hits like him, if not harder. No problems at all. Just have to be sure handler knows how to catch a dog like that to avoid injury as well as limiting courage tests to trials and not to show off.|
by judron55 on 15 March 2012 - 11:11
|I asked because of a discussion we were having on a pedigree list I'm on. The individual stated they didn't want a linebreeding on Nick and stated why. The main reason was back problems. Also there was concern about stubborness and lack of work ethic. I have a bitch linebred on Nicks' sire and dam...female through Nick and male through Jaro vom Ruhbachtal..repeat breeding of Nick. I've also heard that Nick had prostate problems. I know from discussions that Nicks' litter was not considered an overall good litter...and that Nicko was considered a much better dog....thanks folks....|
by Lynx on 15 March 2012 - 12:23
|//was possibly not the sire of some of his offspring due to such.//|
////////It can be checked by DNA test. Have anyone heard about Nick's offsprings that their DNA was not confirmed?
by Gustav on 15 March 2012 - 13:02
|Nick is a dog that i don't mind seeing in a pedigree, but wouldn't want a dog linebred on him. But that's just me....I'm sure there are some good dogs linebred on him, but I place a lot of value in whether a great dog has brothers and sisters with high negatives. Because the great dog is made up of the same genetics as the brothers or sisters.|
by cphudson on 15 March 2012 - 13:17
|Scary if this is true. I own a grand daughter of Nick, who's sire is line bred off of Nick. She is very nice in temperament & drive. She is very forceful in protection / obedience. She was worked very hard in her former owners home.|
Now at 6 years old she has back issues. She has a slip / bulged disk + arthritis in her lower back & now in her neck too. Vet's do not see anything that is genetic, but her body has suffered from her early over training in protection.
I don't believe it's genetic. She just uses her body like it's a bull dozer & does everything full force even protection / fetching ball / jumping hurdles, etc. Nothing slows her down.
by judron55 on 15 March 2012 - 15:49
| Vet's do not see anything that is genetic, but her body has suffered from her early over training in protection.|
what did the vets see? what test where done to see if it was genetic? Not saying they or you are wrong...just wondering what test they do? I worked a male that developed back problems...eventually was on wheels until death...I have never experienced a dog with back problems....hope I never do.
Gustav...correct about the genetics...:-)
by BlackthornGSD on 15 March 2012 - 15:59
|Koos told me pretty much the same thing that QMan reported, when Koos was in NJ with Nick some years ago (1999/2000?)--Nick was about 6 at that time and had a noticeably "dead" tail and we were told it was an injury.|
Some conditions that might contribute to back injuries that we might be wary of are transitional vertabrae as well as cauda equina--either of these might make an injury more of a problem than it might be otherwise.
All GSDs, the Va Tech vet school spine surgeon told me years ago, have spinal canals that narrow more than in other breeds. Sometimes this is bad enough to cause problems in and of itself. But even if it doesn't cause problems, a small injury that might not cause issues in another breed can cause a problem great enough to require surgery in a GSD (there's less room for "error" in the spinal canal).
by cphudson on 16 March 2012 - 12:14
|The vets did xray's, MRI's, blood work, & DNA test for DM. She does not show degeneration of the spine, but does have slip disc. Arthritis has started in one location.|
I'm being referred out to a specialist soon. Right not she is functioning with a few limitations & pain management. I'm sure surgery will be in the near future.
Christine, my vet's told me the samething about this case.
by Jeff Oehlsen on 16 March 2012 - 16:29
|Where was the injury at in the spine ?|