German Shepherd Dog > Crate unhealthy for a dogs for their behavior (78 replies)
by Blitzen on 21 January 2012 - 15:21
|More valid reasons for using crates.|
by LMH on 21 January 2012 - 15:30
|I gather your post is aimed at me, Blitzen. I'm pretty adept at handling my responses and trying to not step on anyone's toes, but I do "resent" (your word) "those who crate their dogs are bad dog owners and those who don't are better or more caring dog owners." NO ONE said that......hence, I didn't; and "There's a lot more to being a responsible dog owner than whether or not one uses a crate to contain a dog." That's a ridiculous line and totally sidesteps.|
"Simply put," (my earlier words), I'm pissed. Allow me my opinion, please. I, certainly, have always allowed you yours. If mistaken in the intent of your last post, I can apologize. If, sadly, I'm spot on, I've had my say with the exception of repeating my profound sentiment that I HATE CRATES and am content. Over 20 people commented on this thread. Only a few ventured forth an alternative, but still compromising postion to yours by sugar coating with the acceptable good uses for a crate. I didn't. Can there be EVEN one dissenting opinion on this board ever again?
by Jenni78 on 21 January 2012 - 15:41
|LMH, I think you're overreacting. The sentiment that you provoked (whether or not you said it) was that those who crate are at the very least, lazy, and the very worst, uncaring. That's what it seems Blitzen is referring to, at least to me. This is why I explained my boring lifestyle stuff. |
To further expound, since you say there was a shortage of alternatives, I have a decent yard split into several big kennels/small yards, however you want to view them. They each have a nice house, a separate bathroom area w/wood chips, their own tree or shrub, and some grass. I could use these in lieu of crates, and get rid of the crates, I suppose, EXCEPT:
1) that doesn't keep my dogs safe from someone coming into the yard when I'm not home.
2) they could still get accidentally bred in a fenced area
3) all but Capri are fence jumpers, so how secure are they in my fenced yard?
You mention baby gates. I'm sorry, but that's honestly kind of funny. Baby gates? To separate large aggressive dogs? I think it's wonderful if that works for you, but to infer that those who put the safety of ALL ahead of everything else are either lazy or uncaring is offensive. Now, I have to say that I do think you are entilted to your opinion, and it doesn't bother me a bit. It wouldn't work for my dogs, so I don't use it. Take what you need, leave the rest. But you can't really be "pissed" when you strike a nerve with statements like that. I really don't understand the hostility over this, frankly. If it's just a difference of opinion, why the tone???
by LMH on 21 January 2012 - 16:00
|Think what you want, little girl. For once in your life, butt out.....ESPECIALLY when it's blatantly obvious that a post has not been directed to you.|
by Jenni78 on 21 January 2012 - 16:27
|You got it, old|
by Blitzen on 21 January 2012 - 17:36
LMH, I think you're overreacting. The sentiment that you provoked (whether or not you said it) was that those who crate are at the very least, lazy, and the very worst, uncaring. That's what it seems Blitzen is referring to, at least to me. This is why I explained my boring lifestyle stuff.
Blitzen responds: It was.
by Keith Grossman on 21 January 2012 - 19:04
by Red Sable on 21 January 2012 - 23:24
LMH, you are calling us liars because we said our dogs love their crates. How would you know? You have never even used one, so where are you getting your information from? Did anyone call you a liar for what you believe? No, so show us the same respect for having a different opinion to yours.
by Chaz Reinhold on 22 January 2012 - 00:14
by mentayflor on 22 January 2012 - 00:38
|I can understand those who say that you put the doggy into the crate because you have reasons to do that. But those who say that put the dogs there because they love to stay at the crat, I would ask them if you let the door of the crate open, as they love it...|
by Chaz Reinhold on 22 January 2012 - 00:47
|What kind of question is that? I love my bed, but I get out of it to live my life.|
by mentayflor on 22 January 2012 - 01:15
|I meant if they love to be crated there is no reason to shut the door|
by Chaz Reinhold on 22 January 2012 - 01:38
|I would imagine they don't shut the door unless they're leaving, etc. Depending on age and the dog, I value my stuff. Pups and criminals get locked up.|
by yellowrose of Texas on 22 January 2012 - 02:09
I AGREE CHEZ
If you have 8 germans in your possession, explain where you put them if you do not shut the door on the crate?
When we train on the schutz field, at the club..where do you put a dog when you are not training it, and it has just finished its routine, ?
Do you just throw it in the back of your brand new truck or car loose and come back to slobber, smell and scratches all over the truck or car?
At home how do you make a puppy listen or where do you put it while you cook supper, or sleep or go to work.??
If you own one pup and want to use a baby gate...I will send you mine in pieces , and chewed up while I was at the store..
of send the bill to the Church deacons to pay for the wall, the cabinet, the chewed up shower curtain, and the new toilet seat and facial boards needed, a new return water line under the toilet, and sump pump for the 30 gallons of water in my home , after Cashius clay got thru with 2 hours in the bathroom,...instead of his crate.
Just a little humour here, but my RAINBOW Vaccum cleaner , and my dog crates, and wire kennels , DO NOT TOUCH OR REMOVE.
by Chaz Reinhold on 22 January 2012 - 02:14
|Good point, YR. My dogs get so fricking excited to see a crate in the vehicle.|
by yellowrose of Texas on 22 January 2012 - 02:27
There was really a story in our Schutzhund Magazine, years ago, written by daughter of a member, who came home from school, to open the back door and water rolled out..
Their new schutzhund prospect pup was locked in the bathroom while mommy and kids were at school and work...THEY didn't believe in crates...cruel , and unhealthy and oh no , never would we do that !!
Daughter called mom in panic and then the Pup was rescued from the bathroom where it had chewed the water line under the toilet into pieces and water filled their 17,000 sq foot down stairs home.
TO the tune of $20,000.00 , later, the family bought crate for home, and kennel for outdoors and they realized the NICE crate Price of $60.00 was the best and most valuable purchase they had made that year..
Somewhere I have that article tucked away and I made copies and gave to all my puppy buyers as a part of their package they took home ..with the new pup..
by Jenni78 on 22 January 2012 - 02:48
|Caleb turned the water valve on the toilet until he made himself a really fun geyser to play slip 'n slide in. LOL I didn't shut him in the bathroom; I think I had just fallen asleep and being obsessed with water, he discovered the fun he could have with that valve. I needed new hallway carpeting anyway. To this day, he will turn outside faucets on and not shut them off. Annoys me to no end; if you are smart enough to turn it on, be considerate enough to turn it off! |
Had I had a 'normal' job or had kids or something that would take my attention, I would've had no choice but to crate him.
by yellowrose of Texas on 22 January 2012 - 05:56
|All these kids stay in crates during different times a day and sleep in the A/c nursery or heated if needed at night in wire crates...THEY run to their crates for their raw chicken necks ..BUT|
For the last 3 months I have had one continual problem with three of my 4 females here, and today I told Chelsie , the next hole that gets dug in the middle of my walk way, the one that did it , is gonna get buried like the game we use to play down in Galveston , called how long can we stand it under the SAND~~~~~~~
Every bit of a 5 ft hole , sandy loam soil, by Chelsie, Bhandi and Mom Hexe..fILL IT UP, by tomorrow at 4 pm it is dug out again......and again.....and again......
We have covered it uip with back hole , put pepper in it, concrete in it and poop in it and nothing but putting my truck over this spot..keeps them from sneaking a dig and they are very quick about it.
THEY run to the trees when I appear and look back at me saying nannannna naw naw!
Chelsie stays in side in sun room and yes she has a crate .. Bhandi is loose 3 hours then kennel then Hexe and czuiker run for 3 hours, and then ABBY, WHO does not dig., and Raydo run for three hours. I get duty of play for one hour or so each time. Then all go back to their outdoor kennels until 1 am or 2 am for out time and then to bed in an indoor nursery.
Today was go to town day for the girls, and yes, they ride in a crate.
Chelsie dug a 3 ft hole by the gate while I was changing to go to town..
Do not know what is with the digging but good thing I live in the country...All these girls are over 5 except Chelsie and she is 4yrs old..
Guess it is a gremlin under the place or maybe Oil or maybe a vein of Gold down there..
The males are too busy chasing the horses down the road, peeing on all 340 trees and looking for squirrels and hidden kongs so they have not dug up anything..They all keep the big limbs towed to all parts of the property..MUST be the cold or the Howl of the Night Creatures here that are doing strange things to my dogs heads and minds..I threatened to put a grate over the hole and make that whoever gets caught their crate for a week...They would just push it up and out of way or dig another route out..
My dogs are so bored in crates....not...so do not offer that for a reason..they are just being K9's
now that they are becoming middle age I guess it is like Betty White's new show...OFF their ROCKERS!!!!
by Abby Normal on 22 January 2012 - 13:01
|YR LOL - You definitely wouldn't be able to trust 8 Germans left alone in your house!|
FWIW I am not a fan of crates, and am lucky that I have always been able to adapt my environment to suit the dogs that I have had at any given time to be safe to leave for brief periods, and the rest of the time be free with supervision. The concept of crating came to the UK much later than the US (in fact I think it came to us from the US). However, I can see that it all depends on an individual situation, and sometimes there is a need. For those dogs that are used to it and have been accustomed to it from an early age, I believe they do indeed feel very comfortable and relaxed in their crates. Those I know at sporting events when not on the field are very chilled in their crates. When I was looking after my friends puppy who was crate trained, he would take himself off to his crate for a good sleep of his own volition, so he was clearly very happy in one. So I am not anti, in the right hands, just not keen on them for me. On a selfish note, I also really don't want to spend my life with several crates in my house for ever more!
Like others have said, it is common sense and moderation and horses for courses.
Unfortunately there are some who will abuse their use and simply crate for convenience and do so for 8 hrs or more a day while they are at work, and those dogs I feel terribly sorry for.
Interesting that you mentioned learning things have you ever read Merle's Door?
by mentayflor on 22 January 2012 - 13:15
|Hi Yellowrose, you are right in respect of bathrooms is not place for pets, I have enough bad experiences and always close the door of my bathroom even if i'm at home, besides when doogs are enclosed they become anxious and break everythings. The thing is to educate the pups, it take time and energy, but as in humans education is a treasure for their future.|