German Shepherd Dog > Who Do You Trust (288 replies)
by Blitzen on 14 January 2012 - 16:21
by GSD2727 on 14 January 2012 - 17:06
|I can second the recommendation for Vom Reichtal. I bought my foundation female Libby from them back in 1997. They were honest, easy to work with and we have kept in contact over the years. I have seen several other dogs from their breeding also that were very nice. I couldnt have been happier with my Libby (she just passed in Sept at over 14 years old!). I am really fortunate to still have her daughter and granddaughter with me now. I would deal with Vom Reichtal again without hesitation.|
by Gustav on 14 January 2012 - 17:27
|Thank You Joanro!!|
by joanro on 14 January 2012 - 17:53
|One more point to consider, Blitzen, when does the "mutation" cease to mutate? You are very welcome, Gustav, my pleasure.|
by Blitzen on 14 January 2012 - 18:15
What is "cease to mutate"? How do you know that the gene that can cause DM is a mutation and has not been present in the breed since day one?
by Red Sable on 14 January 2012 - 19:05
Are we so bottlenecked in this breed we have to breed dogs with DM? or bad hips? Where do you draw the line? Isn't it better to know if your dogs have the DM gene than to play Russian roulette with puppies and puppy buyers?
by joanro on 14 January 2012 - 19:14
|No, I don't believe that's the case, but when did and when does the gene mutate? If you have a herd of buffalo and any white ones are culled along with the parents you won't have any more white ones until the mutation occurs again. That's the way it is with mutations.|
by Blitzen on 14 January 2012 - 19:35
Joanro, unless there is sustantial data on the lifespan and causes of death in this breed backmassed to the foundation dogs, there is no evidence that GSD's haven't suffered from DM since day one. We don't know that anymore than we know that none of the foundation dogs had bad hips or bad elbows or peri-anal fistulas.
by Blitzen on 14 January 2012 - 19:39
|RS, I don't remember that thread about VitK. If you happen to find it, I'd like the link please. Reading that and having a dog with suspected DM that was eating Nutro would make me suspicious too.|
by GSD2727 on 14 January 2012 - 20:40
|IMO the biggest reason a lot of breeders do not test for DM yet is because some are not aware of the big issue. Simple fact is some people haven't dealt with DM. I haven't had a dog with DM or even known one in person who had DM. I have heard the stories online and know it is heart breaking. However, if someone hasnt spent the time on online message boards, it is possible they are not aware of what a problem DM can be! For those who are aware of it, some do not realize there is a test available. OR they may have heard of it but do not understand it. They do not want to throw "the baby out with the bath water" and do not realize that the test isnt like that - you can still breed carriers and even affected dogs if you do it right - but most do not understand that! |
IMO it comes down to education! And putting the breeders who do not test for it down is not going to help anything. Having everyone test isnt going to happen overnight. When I first started very few people xray'd elbows! I was the oddball for doing my dogs elbows. It was nice when others started doing it.... but it took quite awhile for everyone to jump in and even longer for it to be required. Heck, from what I understand this is the first year USCA is requiring elbow cert for Kkl!!! It takes time.
Educate people about the test, dont bash them for not doing it yet.
And while DM is a heartbreaking disease it is just ONE part of the dog and ONE thing to consider when breeding. I have seen some people advertise on this site with DM clear dogs yet their dogs are lacking in other areas. That is no better IMO. We always need to look at the whole picture.
JMO of course
by joanro on 14 January 2012 - 20:40
|There is likewise no evidence that they have suffered from it since day one. What I meant to say and failed to was, what triggered the mutation and will normal genes mutate once again, since mutation implies that there had to be normal genes to start with. That is probably a question with no definitive answer.|
by Red Sable on 14 January 2012 - 20:44
It was Denison's post that caught my eye.
Anyway, it may be coincidence, however, I've never fed Nutro since!
by Blitzen on 14 January 2012 - 22:05
by Blitzen on 14 January 2012 - 22:29
|Thanks, RS. Sometimes I think I should just make my own dog food.|
by beetree on 14 January 2012 - 22:34
|RS: I just question what he says about spending $1500 for a definitive DM diagnoses in '08. Nothing about that statement rings true for me. Just sayin'.|
by aaykay on 16 January 2012 - 03:30
Came across this thread and it too had degenerated for a while into personal attacks and (baseless) accusations against certain members, like the other "hips" thread. Thank goodness it is back on an evener keeling, and people are actually contributing useful thoughts.
by Jenni78 on 16 January 2012 - 03:38
EXCELLENT post, Valerie! This is precisely what I've been trying to say.
by Slamdunc on 16 January 2012 - 03:46
|baseless--- like the other "hips" thread. LOL|
by joanro on 16 January 2012 - 13:45
|Aaykay, what "baseless" accusations are you referring to? I hope you are not going to reply what I think you are going to.|
by Jenni78 on 16 January 2012 - 16:28
|Interesting how different people read things to mean completely different things. I didn't take aaykay's post that way at all, I mean, that the hip thread was "baseless." It seemed, if you read closely, that s/he meant this thread had baseless accusations and had degenerated to personal attacks like the hips thread. I could be way wrong; that's just simply how I read it and was suprised to read the other posts taking it the other way. |