German Shepherd Dog > Look at these hips (763 replies)
by Blitzen on 30 December 2011 - 04:15
If Chrissy can't accept a replacement puppy right now, IMO the only fair thing to do would be to refund the purchase price to her plus the shipping. Given this little guy was severely overshot when he was shipped here, I have to think this would not be a breeder I would want to buy a dog from or a breeder I would ever recommend to anyone. I find it especially telling that not only did the breeder ignore the bite, so did the broker here in the US. Did I understand that right? Sounds like a big cluster $%@$ to me.
by Slamdunc on 30 December 2011 - 04:21
|I am assuming that "replacement" means returning the pup and getting a replacement.|
by ChrissyKim89 on 30 December 2011 - 04:26
|Usually it is a return for replacement, but in this case I doubt the breeder wants the dog back. He already offered replacement and offered to let me keep Kaiser when I let him know about his dental issues.|
by Slamdunc on 30 December 2011 - 04:26
LMAO. Of course you can and you obviously know the rules when it comes to calling me "Jim." I am flattered.
Unless of course you are a mod, then it is slam.
by Slamdunc on 30 December 2011 - 04:29
Thanks for clarifying that. That is far better than asking for return of the pup, that makes a bitter pill a little easier to swallow. Isn't there a litter mate available for replacement?
by Jenni78 on 30 December 2011 - 04:32
|Whew. I'm glad I got something right and that at least one thing isn't as bad as it seemed.|
by Chaz Reinhold on 30 December 2011 - 04:32
|Why would a breeder want a dog with HD and an overbite? I could understand a breeder requesting xrays, etc., but why would you want someone's dog back? It's not a car. Scummy breeders never want to just return the $. That cuts into profit. Wonder how this messes with their pristine hip rating. Or doesn't it count if it wasn't sent to ofa?|
by Blitzen on 30 December 2011 - 04:35
I DO know the rules, that's why I asked
by Jenni78 on 30 December 2011 - 04:38
|I would say MOST breeders don't want to return the money. Most of them don't like to be called scummy, though I would agree. |
They don't want the dog back; they just want to use it as a leveraging chip. People don't usually want to send the dog back, so they avoid standing behind their guarantee. I'm speaking generally here, not about anyone in particular. How many breeders really offer a "no strings" guarantee?
by ChrissyKim89 on 30 December 2011 - 04:41
|Well the breeder kept a male and female and the broker kept a male, but the broker already told me before he didn't want to give me his pup and I didn't insist.|
by Jenni78 on 30 December 2011 - 04:43
|Would you even want a littermate? I don't know what your plans are, but I probably would not breed a littermate to this dog, and you are planning on keeping Kaiser, so a pet would seem to be a moot point.|
by Blitzen on 30 December 2011 - 04:45
|I've known breeders who require the dog be returned before they will refund or replace. It's a breeder's fail safe knowing that most buyers are not going to return their dog. Some will tell the buyer they will take the dog back, but have no room for it so it will have to be PTS. I guess most of us would keep the dog and forget about it. Mission accomplished for the breeder.|
by ChrissyKim89 on 30 December 2011 - 04:48
|Nope, I don't even want another dog from this breeder TBH.|
by Blitzen on 30 December 2011 - 04:51
|I wouldn't either.|
by Jenni78 on 30 December 2011 - 04:58
|I hear ya, Chrissy. But it's nice at least that the offer was extended and you weren't completely blown off. |
Well, I don't know what else to say. It's a hell of a blow. I don't know if you ever want another one, but I was sincere in my offer a few pages back. It will be months before I have pups ready to go, but if Kaiser is on the mend and you are ready, I will give you a pup. I'm really impressed how focused you are on the important part here (Kaiser) and the way you have handled this, not wasting time and breath bashing and just focusing on helping your dog. Any dog would be lucky to be yours, I can tell. Kaiser, I'm sure, can be made to live a happy life with help, and if you feel like trying again for a dog you can work, I would be honored to send you one. There are not enough homes like you out there.
Hang in there.
When you find out what you're doing, please PM or email me donation information. I have been sort of where you are. It's not a happy place. You get through it though, and the money was worth it when you see them "normal" and happy. Mine was 5mos. Not the same issue, but just as serious a surgery, and she is now 4 and you would NEVER know there was ever anything wrong with her. Hoping you have a similar outcome.
by Slamdunc on 30 December 2011 - 05:01
Did you mention that you didn't originally want a pup with a huge overbite and crippling HD? Who knows where this breeder will be in 5, 8 or 10 years when you are ready for a replacement pup. Again, you are a really nice person. Maybe, you could email the broker and breeder the links to the thread that have been posted. That may make him / her more amicable to working with you. It seems some brokers / breeders really respond and quickly when this type of information comes out. You have been very considerate and honorable by not mentioning the name of the breeder. Since they are aware of the situation I hope they do the right thing by this pup.
by Abby Normal on 30 December 2011 - 10:01
You are indeed a dog and breeders dream owner. Kaiser will never know how lucky he is.
I believe anyone can set up a donation account/page 'Just Giving'. I know someone who did it for sponsorship, and someone else who did it to help raise funds for a rescue dog who needed surgery. It is a really easy way for people then to just log in to the page and donate at the click of a button, no matter where they are in the world. I don't know how you do it, but I'm sure someone on here be able to help you get it set up. It will be useful for you to know how much has been donated too, so you know financially just where you are. We all want to start 2012 by helping you and Kaiser, I can't think of a better way to start the New Year!
I do think you should respond to the breeder and press for an alternative to the strict terms of the contract, in the circumstances. After all, if they sell *your* replacement pup to someone else and simply give you the money what's the difference? They'll even save themselves the shipping costs !
I'm sure you are on overwhelm right now, and need to take a breath. Glad to hear your own vet may be able to do the surgery, and that you will be exploring all options for Kaiser in the meantime. It's all rather frightening, but surgery will give Kaiser a virtually normal life (I only say virtually in that you wouldn't try and make him a sport dog!), and it will be pain free. He will be able to be an active companion. In the meantime just to say, one thing I feel sure of, and that is, in a completely different way to how you envisaged, Kaiser will turn out to be your dream dog - no doubt.
by workingdogz on 30 December 2011 - 10:05
|Chrissy should accept the puppy and then sell him to help defray costs of the care Kaiser will need.|
It's about all she's going to get from the breeder/broker at this point.
Perhaps if they know she will sell the puppy, they will do so themselves and just send her the proceeds from the sale of her "replacement puppy".
The one she may not have ever needed had she been given the choice of accepting a puppy with a bad overbite.
It would make much more sense to simply refund this girls purchase price PLUS shipping costs.
Afterall, it was the breeder/broker who "handpicked" her pup, so ultimately the responsibility should fall on him/them for sending her a puppy to begin with.
Chrissy, perhaps you can suggest this, the "replacement puppy" be sold by them, the breeder/brokers, and they simply send you the funds. Seems fair.
I'm still curious as to whether or not the breeder/broker beat her to the airport and picked out his pup first from the crate...
In the meantime, do all you can to keep him comfortable and get him as fit as possible.
Once you know which direction you are going with surgery, please update this post and we can all send our donations to the vet clinic to help defray the costs.
by duke1965 on 30 December 2011 - 12:21
|chrissy , all the best to you and your dog , I guess all is said in this topic , no need for me to repaet , onlything , if I where you , have his albows checked before you do anything furher , like someone wrote , it might change the path your choosing to go , or on the other hand , give you a good feeling that you dont have to worry about that later too|
secondly , if breeder and broker are keeping this breedingstock and littermates it will mean more people will be set up for heartache in the nearby future , not a pretty thought
by danny killeen on 30 December 2011 - 12:26
The OP states:
And for those of you who were curious, my breeder did email me back this morning. He only offered a replacement with shipping at no charge when I felt I was ready for another dog as per the contract. Honestly, I did not expect much more then that; I was surprised he even tossed in the shipping cost really since he's not even obligated to that much. I won't be ready for another dog for awhile though.
I have to say this is generous enough, but then I read the following....
He already offered replacement and offered to let me keep Kaiser when I let him know about his dental issues
Now, I cannot understand why the offer of a replacement wasn't accepted at that point. Yes, it is hard to part with a pup, but how much harder is it now?
Those who hint at poor breeding and underhandedness need to look at the bigger picture: reality! We have to accept that eben the strongest blood, with the best/safest breeding program can and does throw up the occasional health issue.
The purpose of a warranty etc is to provide peace of mind. If I bought a pup inder these circumstances I would have accepted the replacement offered, as long as I believed the breeding/potential to be equal or superior to the original pup.
Whilst I acknowledge and admire Chrissy's compassion, it it not what I would do.
I am sure we all have suspicions about who the broker/breeder is, and I am sure that they have read all of this. The fact that they don't seem to have replied tells me that they are confident that they have acted reasonably and in compliance with the terms of the sale.
All that said, if there is a justgiving site set up, I'll donate $50 too, but hard as it seems, I think the dog should be PTS and the OP be allowed to enjoy a dog of ordinary health. That statement won't make me popular and isn't intended to upset anyone, it is just how I view these things.