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ForumsGerman Shepherd Dog > 11 month GSD dominant aggressive HELP (48 replies)
11 month GSD dominant aggressive HELP by Jon and buddy on 04 October 2011 - 21:49 |
| Buddy has always been dominant but has got a lot better over the past few months as we have stepped up re affirming pack leader. (i eat first, no taking the piss around the house etc) for the most part this is fine. He is still a bit cheeky but i manage. The main concerns which are getting to the point where they really need to be resolved are as follows:- First one is, he seems lazy on command. getting him to sit he either wont or does it after constant request and maybe a push of his bum. In fact all commands are not done instant unless there is very tasty treats after. His recall is appalling. but then i am guilt of letting him off the lead when we get to the fields. second and main one, he will not release the ball or stick when outside. He is so large now that when i try to take it off him he just starts growling... to avoid a dominance confrontation i just let him have it but mainly i cant get it off him. When we get back home he is calm again. please please help, i have tried the having 2 balls method. he will release them as he should one after the other but he wont let it go on command and if i try to pick the one up he has just released he snaps at it! Please any help will be greatly received. jon |
by Ibrahim on 04 October 2011 - 22:00 |
| Interesting topic |
by mirasmom on 04 October 2011 - 22:10 |
| First off, When you tell him to sit and I mean tell not ask, say it once, if he doesn't sit then you can push his behind down. No more freedom, no more off leash until you have a reliable recall, meanwhile you can use a flexi leash. He should also be sporting a prong collar, from which he will eventually graduate from. My dogs are not allowed to growl at me, I would nip that one in the butt quick with a HEY!!!!! HEY!!! UH UH , and you tell him leave it, or drop it, use a walking stick when you are outside with him, it tells him "I am the leader, don't mess with me" I use a walking stick, kinda like sheep herding with your dog, sometimes they may need a tap to the side of their hind leg....only a tap....it diverts their attention. One last thing, don't let him sleep on your couch or bed, those area's are reserved for the pack leader only! Lots of luck, Paula |
mirasmom by Ibrahim on 04 October 2011 - 22:23 |
| Beautiful post Paula, I like the stick technique. Ibrahim |
by beetree on 04 October 2011 - 22:38 |
| Getting him to release the ball, you should just try to ignore him. Call him once and if he ignores you, walk away, go in the house, refuse to play. He will realize the game ends, unless he brings and drops the ball. I explain this to my kids all the time. If you go after him for the ball, all you do is create a new game that he is in control of called: Keep away. |
beetree by Sunsilver on 05 October 2011 - 00:06 |
| My male GSD growled and snapped at me once when I tried to take a toy away from him. I pinned him to the ground and held him down until he submitted. It never happened again. Also, agree with above suggestions re. recall and other commands. First thing I learned way back when i got my first dog: once the dog understands the command, he gets ONE chance to obey it, then he gets a physical correction. That is one of THE most important principles in training! Since the dog has to be bribed into obeying I would also eliminate the treats, and just use praise as a reinforcement. |
Sunsilver by Ace952 on 05 October 2011 - 00:15 |
| shoot a video so we can see exactly what you are doing and what the dog is doing. |
Ace952 by Slamdunc on 05 October 2011 - 01:20 |
| Sun, Alpha rolling is a very risky proposition and not really used by trainers that handle aggressive dogs any longer. Jim |
Slamdunc by Siantha on 05 October 2011 - 01:30 |
| i got a 1 and a 1/2 year old male shepherd that was exactly like this i put a prong collar on him and i didnt play nicely we had our moments finealy he started to listen. then he would never bring the ball back he would sit in the yard and destroy it. didnt care if i walked away or not. so i put him on a long line and taught him to come back. then it was trying to release i got bit once or twice but that was all i used the pinch collar grabbed the ball "put the ball on a string to avoid biteing :D " and i held the ball said Out and then gave him corrections till he droped it it took One relly good session of this and then fetch was his favorite game and i slowly did graduate off the pinch collar onto just a fursavor and he did wonderfuland i had a very good friend |
Siantha by jc.carroll on 05 October 2011 - 01:53 |
| I wouldn't recommend a flexi lead. Cheap plastic, breaks easily, and no way to reel the dog back in if he refuses to come back. Seen so many flexi-gone-wrong incidents in my life; the most common being it getting ripped out of the owner's hand. The second-most being a dog acting up at the end of the lead, and no way to administer a correction or bring the dog back. I'd advocate a length of nylon webbing, perhaps even a section of bungee added to soften the impact for him hitting the end if he's a bolter. A bungee'll also lessen the shock for your shoulders as well. Something like this added to the long-line [link]. |
jc.carroll by Duderino on 05 October 2011 - 02:40 |
| Don't just put a pinch collar on the dog without having someone with experience watch you do it. You're going to get bit. He's growling at you to send you a message. |
by Sunsilver on 05 October 2011 - 03:34 |
| Slamdunc, I didn't try to roll him, just put my arm on his neck and pinned him with my arm and body. Id only had him for 2 days at the time, and was just bringing him home from his former owner. Yeah, I know, it's a good way to get bitten if the dog is really strong, and my heart was pounding. He's a big boy: just over 80 lbs. and 25 1/2 inches. All I knew at the time was Kohler's methods. But what the hey...it worked! I use a 30 ft. horse's lunge line for training the recall, and for tracking. You can get them at any tack store. Window sash cord works too, but you'd better wear gloves! (Found that out the hard way.) |
by Slamdunc on 05 October 2011 - 04:02 |
| Slamdunc, I didn't try to roll him, just put my arm on his neck and pinned him with my arm and body. Id only had him for 2 days at the time, and was just bringing him home from his former owner. Yeah, I know, it's a good way to get bitten if the dog is really strong, and my heart was pounding. He's a big boy: just over 80 lbs. and 25 1/2 inches. All I knew at the time was Kohler's methods. But what the hey...it worked! Yes, that is alpha rolling. Basically, forcing the dog to the ground and holding him there against his will. It does work with a lot of dogs, it's the dogs that it doesn't work with that are the problem. I'm glad it worked with that dog and you did not get bit. It is taking a chance however and those that are hesitant or slow, might wind up getting bit badly. |
by Chaz Reinhold on 05 October 2011 - 04:08 |
| Dude, how is that different than the road she is on? Do you not like quick results? OP, find a good trainer in your area. BEETREE, not saying you are wrong, but i find your method confusing. You have a dog that is telling you to piss off and leave me alone, and you believe that the dog will think that he's being punished by you leaving his area without getting the ball and he has just won? |
Chaz Reinhold by Duderino on 05 October 2011 - 04:47 |
| No, but what I don't like is telling someone who obviously doesn't know much about dogs or their training to just run out to the local pet store, buy a pinch collar and throw it on a dog with aggression/dominance issues. |
by Donnerstorm on 05 October 2011 - 06:16 |
| Wow I Sounds to me like he and I would be having a serious come to Jesus meeting, the trouble is if you don't know what you are doing your dog may not be the one coming to Jesus just the opposite. We can't diagnose your dog online, we can"t see you or your dog, we don't know what you are doing or not doing nor can we read your dog's body language and gauge your response. We also have NO idea what your experience level is so I'm with Chaz find a trainer, an experienced trainer in your area. |
Donnerstorm by Spooks on 05 October 2011 - 07:34 |
| I am not sure where I saw this or even read about it, but to make a dog release a ball or toy is to put your hand over it's nose and gently fold it's upper lips under it's top teeth and put pressure on gently, I emphasise gently as hardly any pressure is needed. Feeling the teeth touch the top lip will (should) make the dog drop the ball/toy instantly or let you remove it from it's mouth. I have tried it on both my dogs and it worked, but I don't know whether part of it was due to the fact that my dogs release once I touch a ball/toy in their mouths. If anyone tries it - l'd be interested to know if it does work. |
Spooks by phrannie on 05 October 2011 - 11:43 |
| Why not take two balls, and make a trade? Folding lips under the teeth, alpha rolling, seem like good ways to get bit (if he is in fact growling seriously)....I mean dogs at play "sound" pretty growly. Toss one ball, when he gets close to you...show him the other. He WILL drop the first ball the second his eyes see that you have another. Throw that and get the first ball. This game really wears them out, too. The very fact that you are controlling the game, ups your status....and in a positive way. p |
by Slamdunc on 05 October 2011 - 12:04 |
| Spooks, The op wrote: "second and main one, he will not release the ball or stick when outside. He is so large now that when i try to take it off him he just starts growling... to avoid a dominance confrontation i just let him have it but mainly i cant get it off him. When we get back home he is calm again. ". I don't think grabbing this dogs muzzle and folding his lip over and pinching is going to help this situation. A pain induced correction such as this may very well get the OP bit. I'm glad this worked for you, but is not an approach that I would use. I really do not care for that technique even with puppies. Dropping a ball is the least of the OP's worries. Jmo, Jim |
by beetree on 05 October 2011 - 12:05 |
| Chaz, it is doggy reverse psychology! I swear to god it works, with my dog anyway. He's just as ball crazy as they come, BUT there are times when he wants me to play "his way" and mommy don't play that game, LOL What he'll do to test me, or the kids every now and then is take his ball in the middle of the field and give me a single bark, he puts a paw on the ball pretty much willing his way... he wants me to go out after him in the field. However, in the minutes after the bus leaves with the ground all dewy and me not having a full cup of coffee, I have no desire to get soggy feet. I will only play if he brings the ball up on the deck, and drops it at my feet. So, if he doesn't do that, I say to him, "I can't throw the ball unless you bring it to me!" And I turn my back on him, or even go inside and shut the sliders. Sure enough, moments later there is the jolly ball sitting right next to the door! . Game on! Now, concerning the OP's problem, I think they have to get past the food reward thing for playing ball for this to work... I think that was a big mistake, but what do I know? |
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