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ForumsGerman Shepherd Dog > A Very Angry Lil' Bit(ch) (36 replies)
A Very Angry Lil' Bit(ch) by Kalibeck on 25 September 2011 - 15:52 |
| Well, many of you read about Carl's complications with his recent surgery, & I appreciate all of your well wishes. Now I have to ask for your opinions on the behavior of Carl's GSD, Lil' Bit. As you can probably surmise, Carl can't care for his dog while he's laid up. All the dogs are used to his care, but Kali, Ansgar, & Beckett have all been trained by me, & respect me, & are wonderful to care for. Then there's Lil' Bit. She's been exclusively Carl's dog, except for an occasional walk or playtime. Lil' Bit is upset. She's usually a good natured prankster, but now she's showing her evil side. I have had to crate her, she's picking fights with the other dogs, & was beating & tearing at the bedroom door to try to get to Carl. She was laying happily at his feet, but when she realized he was not taking her out to her liking, she did a perfect bark & hold in front of him, teeth snapping with every bark. She snaps her teeth at me when I feed her, when I'm putting her collar & lead on her, & when I'm trying to keep her from pulling me over outside. She never pulls Carl. She snaps at me with every correction. And when she figured out I wasn't afraid of all that snapping, she started a new tactic. Now she's charging me, & since I don't flinch, she dives between my legs, bashing her way through, trying to knock me over. She gets a couple of yards away & turns around, looking just like she's laughing at me! So, she must mind me, I won't allow this disrespect. But do you think she's trying to annoy me, hoping that I'll give up & get Carl? Which, of course, can't happen. Any thoughts? jackie harris |
Kalibeck by Kalibeck on 25 September 2011 - 15:56 |
| I guess I can't post photos from my phone, sigh! jackie harris |
by Wanda on 25 September 2011 - 16:13 |
| I am laughing my heart out..............and some would say that dogs have no feelings or emotions???? I have no advise, but hope someone else does! |
Wanda by Donnerstorm on 25 September 2011 - 17:08 |
| I would put a pinch on her and leave her in her crate until it is time to go out, if she acts like an ass, say fine back in you go. Or you can put a pinch on here take her out in the yard and have a come to jesus meeting with her. |
Donnerstorm by BMartin on 25 September 2011 - 17:20 |
| I'm with Donnerstorm.... time for a come to jesus meeting. Shes gotta get knocked down a peg or two. |
by cordon on 25 September 2011 - 17:24 |
| Flipp her! |
by Kalibeck on 25 September 2011 - 17:58 |
 Here she is, I did put a pinch on her, it's slid down her neck in this photo, & thus she was pretty oblivious to my 'bigtime' correction. She did, however, growl at me when I tried to put the collar on next time. I had to grab her by the nose/lip & hold her rather tightly to put the pinch back on, & she stood there like a good one & behaved nicely after that.....but when I put her back in her crate, next time I walked by, I heard a low, soft little growl that quit when I knelt down & made eye contact with her. Then she kind of licked her chops a little, but held eye contact in a challenging fashion. Little terror! LOL! She's gonna have to get over herself pretty quickly, 'cause I'm who she must deal with for awhile. jackie harris |
by GSDNewbie on 25 September 2011 - 18:05 |
| Basic instinct, food control. She only eats what she behaves and accepts from you and continue using corrections at appropriate times. Keep using crate. Perhaps let her crate same room as him see if it helps her be calmer as a whole if his health can take it. Keep long tab on her, but I would never leave a pinch on full time. You control all she needs for now. She cannot see him if it esculates her behavior at all. You may be forced to send her to someone who has daily time to be with her. Removing her from scent of him and home may be best for her state of mind during this time. One of my dogs has issues without me but will stay with my son as long as he knows I am not on the property and am truly not around. Only then will he eat or go outside or settle. When I am home even if I am down with the flu or something he will not even leave me to do his business with the others or even if they try to drag him out of the room. He is a different dog and settles if he knows he is stuck at a property and I am not there so he just has to deal with it. My 220 pound 6 foot 2 husband has to fight this 85 pound 9 year old dog tooth and nail to drag him away from me to take him anywhere I do not go. We make him go off with him because just in case something goes on and they have to care for him they have to be able to. I have only had him a year and he is getting a little better about leaving me lol Even my service dog will jump at the chance to leave my side to go to the store with dad if he is asked along but not this boy. My eldest said it took him two days but he calmed and behaved first time I went out of town leaving the dog and he cared for him. After that he accepted it and behaved each time I went out of town and left him with my son, but my son cannot take him away if I am there. |
GSDNewbie by sueincc on 25 September 2011 - 18:10 |
Jackie if Carl is feeling strong enough, I would ask him to watch my interactions with her and get his opinion on how to handle her, since he is the one most familiar with the bitch. In fact that might be really good for not only the bitch, but for Carl as well, get his mind on something he can help you with. After all, you KNOW how much men LOVE telling us what to do and how rarely we take their advise!!!!!!!! |
sueincc by Kalibeck on 25 September 2011 - 18:24 |
| I don't want to escalate this into an all out war between the two of us, but she really needs to behave with me. Right now she's crated until it's time to go out again. I have to say, for all the snapping she's done, I do not flinch or back down, so I think if she had intended to bite me, she could have done so by now. I wasn't even taking it too seriously, until she started trying to knock me down, & then there was that little growl....! We raised her from our litter, she was the runt, we often had to keep the bigger pups from bullying her. So, she's always considered herself kind of 'special' I guess. And her head was always under my husband's hand, where ever he was. She would tip her head over & give him a kissy little lick every now & then. Today when he used the walker to go to her crate to talk to her, she turns her back to him! She won't even look at him! I don't know whether to LMAO, or .....???? Maybe I'll try to run the devil out of her this evening. Get her good & exhausted, & then see how she's acting. jackie harris |
by GSDNewbie on 25 September 2011 - 18:27 |
| "Barring that, everyone knows I love a good CTJ dog meeting as much as the next guy, but I think in this instance I might want to not start a war with this dog quite yet, after all her world is upside down and she doesn't understand what's going on. It's quite possible that she's not challenging you, she's just flipped out and scared. I think I'd let her calm down for a couple days and then start over with her. Take her for walks, let her hit the end of the pinch, but show no emotion over her bad behaviour, no matter what. Also remember a tired dog is a good dog. Take her out alone and wear her down with some two ball." Exactly why I suggested the things I did for her. |
by Donnerstorm on 25 September 2011 - 18:29 |
| Regardless of the reason she is being an ass, she is being an ass! What is wrong with leaving a pinch on her all the time? I didn't say pinch her constantly! Hook the leash through your belt loop and then to her collar, she has no choice to be next to you and with a pinch she has no choice but to do what she is told. If your pinch slipped down her neck it is too lose, take link out. When you take her out work her butt off in obedience. She I assume knows the commands so if she doesn't do it immediately there is a correction then when she does it praise her. I'm here to tell you I have some pretty big boys and god help them if they even dreamed of growling at me through the crate, and I'm not a very big woman, but I would not put up with that for whatever the reason, remember no matter how much we love them they are dogs, if you don"t make them respect you they won't. And no before the bleeding hearts start complaining, it does not have to be done all with force but if one of mine snarled at me there would be a pinch collar applied and we would be outside so fast their head would spin. |
by GSDNewbie on 25 September 2011 - 18:39 |
| I use the pinch for obedience work. I do not like seeing a dog trying to lay and rest in them getting the prongs stuck in them when not in the middle of a correction. I do not want the dog to hate the collar. I do not want the collar to leave sores on the dog. I do not want them so used to corrections only coming when there is a pinch on them. I can correct any dog and as a woman without a pinch on them. I only use the pinch to sharpen their training personally. I would have to go back and re read but what I was responding to was the idea the pinch should be left on while sitting in a crate.... no thanks. Yep just checked... no, I would NEVER leave a pinch on a dog crated or tethered. Just my opinion. Have you ever seen pinch collar wounds? Have you ever delt with a dog that was so used to a pinch collar it lost its training effectiveness? I think pinch collars are awesome and I suggest them, however There are good uses and like any other training tool they can be used inncorrectly causeing more damage than good IMO. I would remain firm with this dog and I am not saying baby it because it is upset. However I do not feel butting heads with this distressed animal will help as I do own a bitchy bitch myself and if she is anything like mine it is going to get worse instead of better in a physical knock down drag out I am boss you have to listen as long as this collar is on you proceedure. There are other way to correct and work the dog through it. We are not talking a dog that is untrained and disrespectful only because it is taking advantage. I do not know this dog but I do know bitchy dogs lol |
by darylehret on 25 September 2011 - 18:48 |
| All I can say is, if I was laid up in the hospital, I'd be pretty unhappy with anyone discussing my dogs on THIS forum, and not consulting myself for correctional advice. NOT cool. |
darylehret by VomMarischal on 25 September 2011 - 18:50 |
| I'm impressed by the singlemindedness of the bitch, but nevertheless Daryl is right. The only one you should be consulting regarding disciplining the dog is her OWNER>>> Carl. |
by GSDNewbie on 25 September 2011 - 18:56 |
| I assumed she was not trying to stress a very ill man who I understand they did not even know if would make it? Or perhaps she is sharing the info here with him? Could be so many variences to the issue not posted. Perhaps they are both seeking more information and he is not up to asking others himself? I do understand what you are saying as my husband would ask me and when I have been in the hispital he has. I was just extremely ill not in danger of death or recovering from a brush with it. I do hope the poster's husband is out of the danger zone now? I admit I have not kept up with an update besides the first mention of almost looseing him. |
by Two Moons on 25 September 2011 - 18:58 |
| Jackie, What if she was human, I know she's not but what if, would she be easier to read and understand. Dog's know things and feel things that we do overlook, we say it's just a dog. I believe otherwise. If the day comes you might very well be better off putting her dog down as sad as that sounds. I think she knows something is wrong and is angry scared and unsure, not unlike a human in the same situation and acting out. Her world has been turned upside down as she see's it. Punishing her for this will not cure it, perhaps there is a way for her to have some access to Carl, and perhaps she will need to be separated from your other dogs at times. Yes you should be able to control her but I feel no matter what you try there will be times this may not be possible without detrimental effects on you both. So, as you make corrections, remember to have a little compassion too. And in the same situation dealing with bad behavior, what would Carl do and how would he act, tone, body language, attitude. I think you have your hands full at this point and stepping back might give a better perspective. If it were me, I would use an outside kennel and place her in it when she acts badly, for a whole 24 hours, I would have long conversations with her to create a better bond both in and out of this kennel. I would keep her onleash a lot to keep her in a controlled situation. And I would give her some access to Carl whenever possible, let him explain it to her. Dogs react well to soothing voices and rewards for not being a total bitch, and they understand more than we give them credit for. Choose your moments wisely. I hope they both improve and things might get back to normal. Moons. |
Two Moons by sueincc on 25 September 2011 - 19:02 |
| As far as advise for correcting the dog me too, Darryl!! In fact if anyone, family member or otherwise, got it into their heads to start messing with my dogs without my permission let alone correcting them, there would be hell to pay. GSDNewbie you and I may agree on why the dog is acting the way she is but we disagree on how it should be handled. Without first hand knowledge of the dog or it's training to date or the relationship between Jackie and the dog, I think it better that her husband first evaluate what's going on, after all, he's there - we aren't. Suggesting that someone start nailing a dog with corrections when you don't know the first thing about the dog or it's training or it's temperment is hasty in my opinion. Smarter to actually check with the dog owner/handler first. A word to the wise about leaving pinch collars on unattended dogs....I wouldn't do it. I saw a dog almost strangle itself with a pinch left on in the crate at Dogstock one year. One of the prongs somehow got around one of the window bars, (plastic crate with those little side windows) the dog panicked and started twisting around to try and undo it. By the time it registered on all of us what the noise was and we got to where the crate was, the dog was in full blown panick mode and probably not far from strangling. Multiple crate wires had to be cut with wire cutters to undo the thing, thankfully someone had them. |
by LMH on 25 September 2011 - 19:16 |
| Daryl---Jackie isn't betraying Carl here. Bit of a stretch...lol. Jackie----I've been in this situation more times than I care to admit. Broken leg and knee a few years back......broken foot and ankle last summer. What worked here is me taking the leash in hand, hanging off the bed and handing it over saying "go on...go....go for your walk. The direction came from me, and my boy who didn't want to leave eventually got it. Took awhile to become a routine, but I realized I had to make it fun for both of them. Sounds stupid, but have a three way small catch with a ball where you interact together and then have Carl again hand you the leash as he tells her to go. (You make an enemy of her and nothing will work.) BTW---How is Carl feeling? You must be exhausted. |
by sueincc on 25 September 2011 - 19:17 |
| In fact 3 times I have been hospitalized for surgeries that also required pretty extensive rehab. Here is what my husband does with my competition dog: Feed him. Play two ball in the backyard with him. Why 2 ball? No "out" commands. This is a great game because they both love it and again, a tired dog is a very good dog. No correcting my dog, no confrontational shit allowed at all, thank you very much. If the dog gets too antsy into the kennel he goes. |
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