German Shepherd Dog > Video of Personal Protection Dog (50 replies)
by frankm205 on 20 December 2010 - 22:12
|And... you absolutely need a confident dog that is social!!!! Without it you are creating a fear biter, not my opinion a fact.|
by Red Sable on 20 December 2010 - 23:01
|Can you please explain exactly what you mean by social in this instance frank?|
by frankm205 on 20 December 2010 - 23:14
| By social I mean to different environments, street, buildings, cars etc... He should also be neutral to people who are not a threat. By subjecting a dog to these different environments, people, busy streets etc... wil make the dog more confident. I don't mean every Tom Dick or Harry should be able to pet your dog, but he should be social and conditioned enough to people in different places. |
Example, you are walking your personal protection trained dog down the street and a jogger comes running up behind you, the dog should not attack the innocent jogger. Or a small child say 9 -10 yrs old approaches your dog, not a threat, the dog should be tolerant of these types of situations. Basically it is alot of social conditioning that should be incorporated in the training.
by Ace952 on 20 December 2010 - 23:49
You know when it comes to PPD it is a fine line I see. People say that the dog should be social and great everywhere but at the sametime you want him to be protective. Somewhere there has to be some sort of give and take.
by Felloffher on 20 December 2010 - 23:57
|Not speaking for Frank, but maybe social is the wrong term. Indifferent to people is what I like in a good dog.|
by Slamdunc on 21 December 2010 - 00:15
|Actually, I don't think the dog needs to be social but under control. It should be environmentally stable and comfortable in different situations. I think a dog with a slight underlying insecurity that doesn't trust everyone it meets can be a very good PPD. This dog must have natural aggression and be controllable, but wary of strangers and aloof. A dog like that can be a great PPD, often times better than the super confident dog that doesn't find anyone to be a threat. |
Regarding the video and the dog, I think the decoy and the training need to be tweaked a bit.
by Red Sable on 21 December 2010 - 00:31
|I agree Jim, and Felloffher, and with your meaning of social Frank, and Ace too!|
by Pirates Lair on 21 December 2010 - 01:06
|Ace952 – the last video we did was the “Civil work” video, we are going to try and make a |
video that will hopefully explain what a Professionally Trained PPD is in our opinion.
Ronin – I will try and address your concerns and observations; I am a former Peace Officer/K9 Handler
While I have trained one or two dogs, PSD & PPD I do not consider myself a Trainer. I do consider myself
a decent Handler who is constantly striving to improve my skills. And very fortunate to be able to work with a World Class Trainer, which in my opinion are few and far between.
As far as real world experiences, it would be fair to say that I probably have more than the average person, having said that, for reasons of confidentiality I will not discuss them or my achievements. With the background you claim to have, researching me should be easy.
Having read your information I am confused as I am sure many are as to what you do? Your comments range from; (What a reasonably intelligent person would deduce as) your being a Security Guard up to a Secret Service Agent assigned to Presidential detail. And you seem to describe a PSD one moment and then a mediocre PPD the next.
You mention your experience with PPDs failing easy jobs, no dog (which has passed our intial criteria for a PPD/PSD) Ever Fails a job. The Trainer or Handler is always the one who has failed.
If your Trainers or Handlers which you claim to deploy with are failing, please feel free to visit us and observe our dogs working. We would welcome the oppourtunity to conduct a “Real Life” training scenario for our dogs which you think they would fail at.
Our dogs have, and still are being deployed by Government Officials, Corrections, Police Departments, the U.S. Airforce and hundreds of Civilians.
I would respectfully suggest that your experiences with PPDs is limited to some good dogs being handled by inept individuals.
Should you wish to discuss this or learn more about a Professionally Trained PPD please feel free to contact us.
All of our videos can been viewed on our website at; www.canczechdogs.com
Mr. Kim Moore
by Prager on 21 December 2010 - 01:39
|Dog in early stages of protection. It is a good start. Prey training is a start. There is some threat with the stick . Good start. |
More needs to be added. Like courage under stress and hidden sleeve, gun fire, advancing decoy, passive decoy, different decoys and environments, like stairs, slippery floors, dark buildings and so on and on. But good dog. I do not see any problems at this stage.
P.S. Don Corleone why don't you tell us how you start pp training? dan try to say something nice now and then , especially to new people.
by Pirates Lair on 21 December 2010 - 02:32
|Prager - Vynikající komentář příteli|
by Ace952 on 21 December 2010 - 03:26
|Jim...I certainly agree that "under control" is the key phrase. You can have a PPD that is super civil and hard and is naturally suspicious but being able to handle him and keep him/her under control is key.|
Felloffher....Indifferent is probably a better term.
Frank...Certainly understand the point you made and I agree dog does need to be able to be ok in different surroundings.
Pirates....That was a good scenario video that you did and hope you guys are able to do more like that. I look forward to seeing the new video when you get it done.
by Pirates Lair on 21 December 2010 - 03:35
by Don Corleone on 21 December 2010 - 03:59
|Hans, thanks for inviting me to the party! Reading through the thread, I was wondering if anyone as going to say control, and sure enough, Jimmy-boy hit the nail on the head. Control is one of the most important components in a PP dog, or K9 for that matter. Most PP trainers do scenario after scenario with the beligerant bad guy screaming and flaping his arms and unless the handler gives a command or the guy goes to touch the handler, he is off limits. You do call offs, which in sport, never happens unless the dog skips a blind. Where you being a wise guy, Hans? Do you really want to know how I would start a PP dog? I started in dogs doing PP. I knew nothing of sport for a few years until the guy I trained under started making fun of it. I would pretty much start a PP dog the same as any sport dog. Prey first, build confidence, add in some pressure, scenarios, environmental elements and control. Build confidence, confidence and more confidence and add control. Inside, outside, at home, car, walking, hell, in a boat!|
by Don Corleone on 21 December 2010 - 04:13
|Hans, who is this "dan" you are addressing? Was that a typo meant to say Don?|
by Pirates Lair on 21 December 2010 - 04:19
|I knew it was you Fredo, you broke my heart!|
by Don Corleone on 21 December 2010 - 04:22
|Hahaha! I got passed over, Mike. I'm smart, not dumb, like people say. I'm your older brother, and I got passed over!|
by GSDfan on 22 December 2010 - 02:35
Well said slamdunc and Pirates lair...and others.
by Don Corleone on 22 December 2010 - 04:28
|Mel, point well taken, but when I see the title and then the video, I get confused. Thought this was someone showcasing their PPD. There are other ways to work prey other than escapes, but I do understand that training involves much more than seen in the final picture. I just saw that this is a stud dog doing PP. Most videos that are of training, the poster will preface the video with a statement that it is training.|
by GSDfan on 22 December 2010 - 04:43
|Agreed...the video should not have been posted on a public forum with that title...I think we all expected more.|
I don't want to make any digs to his knowledge just based on this, but if he thinks that's a good showcase of a PPD he's got alot to learn. Nothing wrong with the excersise in the course of the training...but certainly not (or not the only thing) what i'd post to show off my dog as a PPD.
by Don Corleone on 22 December 2010 - 04:45
|To further explain why I respond that way, is because you should not send your source of protection away from you when the dog has already done the job. Your a LEO. Do you throw your gun at fleeing suspects? K9 and PPD are two different animals. Explain in a court how your trained protection dog was protecting when the dog chased down a fleeing suspect and bit him. It's the same as shooting someone in the back. anytime the only piece of video for a PPd is an escape, I'm going to respond in the same.|