German Shepherd Dog > Ulf Kintzel and the HGH (44 replies)
by eichenluft on 11 August 2009 - 01:15
|Good Luck!! And have fun with it. I sure wish I were close to Ulf or another HGH trainer with a large flock of sheep!|
by Xeph on 11 August 2009 - 07:10
|Yeah....I'm only about an hour and ten from Geary :) We're going to do a Herding Instinct next Tuesday :)|
by Christopher Smith on 12 August 2009 - 19:56
|Is there anyone training HGH style herding on the west coast?|
by Red Sable on 12 August 2009 - 20:07
|Let us know how it goes Xeph! complete with pics would be nice |
My dad has alot of sheep, but there is no way in hay, he'd let me try my dog on them.
by Xeph on 13 August 2009 - 00:04
|I will, because we've been bumped up to Tomorrow night xD|
by Xeph on 13 August 2009 - 21:23
|We're leaving in in about 30 minutes to try out my girl on sheep...I'm SO nervous x.x|
by Aqua on 14 August 2009 - 17:32
|So how did it go, Xeph?|
by Xeph on 14 August 2009 - 22:34
|*sighs* Nothing :(|
However, Geary himself was honest, but fair and kind. He did say that we could try again in a couple of months and she could come around. He also complimented me on how level headed and easy she was. Nothing bothered her (unfortunately, that included the sheep xD), but she showed no signs of nervousness, walked right away with him when he took the long line, and obeyed commands he gave that she understood.
She was not upset when his (kenneled) Maremma set to barking, nor was she upset when his working dog kept popping his head out of his kennel to watch her.
I appreciated his mention of how she wasn't startled by anything :0
by july9000 on 14 August 2009 - 23:39
|She wasn't interested at all?? Sorry to hear that Xeph..|
How did he started her..in a round pen? Give some details on how the test took place (how does he test them)..i'm curious to know..
One of my girl, who is very obedient, didn't do good in a small pen at the beginning..she was just looking at me for commands, did let herself go because she felt I would tell her no (I always try to tell her to stop chasing the cats and the deers etc LOL). We put her in a big area and then magic occur..I wasn't existing anymore..she rounded those sheeps and was fetching them very naturally..her confidence grew and we tried her again in a small area and she did just perfect..I would love her to do more tending then driving or fetching but we don't have much sheeps around here..twenty is about all you can have.
by Xeph on 15 August 2009 - 00:00
|How did he started her..in a round pen? Give some details on how the test took place (how does he test them)..i'm curious to know..|
Never in a pen. Geary is a real time working Shepherd. He uses Beauceron's to tend his flock, and he had his male out working (lovely to watch). He just had Delphi watch at first, see if she would be interested. When that didn't work, he thought maybe moving the flock to an enclosure would help (Remember, this is HGH...his entire flock is currently in an Open graze, he had to set the enclosure up prior to our arrival), and we just followed behind while he moved the sheep to the pen.
Delphi was more interested in sniffing the grass on the way than she was in the moving sheep.
At the enlcosure, he just had her move around the border, since overall the dog does not interact with the sheep like a Border Collie would. She showed no interest when he purposely startled them up....just kept up with marking and sniffing the grass. *sigh*
It's so hard not to compare her to my workaholic dog...
by july9000 on 15 August 2009 - 01:22
| That's pretty much what I tought it would be (HGH tending style) thanks for the info..|
The dogs isn't suppose interact with the sheep either in border collies..only move them and the only interaction is if the sheep don't move..my instructor always tell me to keep the dog far away not to close..no interaction. The dog is suppose to drive and fetch with a good distance from the sheep..this gives us the time to react and don't scare the flock.
That's too bad..but he's right..maybe in a couple of months this would change..how old is she??
by Xeph on 15 August 2009 - 01:25
|She'll be 3 on Monday|
by Aqua on 16 August 2009 - 16:04
|Three is a good age to start herding and/or tending training.|
Can you describe her prey drive? Does she enthusiastically chase after balls, Frisbees, toys? Does she like to play tug? Has she ever had the opportunity to chase a rabbit or a ground squirrel or other small critter? Do you have a phrase with which you can get her excited? In our house it's "Where's the kitty?"
When you're out on a walk and she's on a long line how does she act? Does she do that typical GSD zig-zag walk in front of you? Is she generally a curious dog?
Take a look at this Website: www.gsdcaherding.com/ There's an article by Diane Wright in the Articles link, titled Evaluating Instinct. The file is in .pdf format. You might find it interesting.
If you should have the opportunity to make a trip to Ulf's farm a weekend getaway, do! Ulf knows GSDs and would be able to stimulate your dog's instinct if it's there.
by Xeph on 16 August 2009 - 17:38
|Can you describe her prey drive? |
Thus far there isn't one.
Does she enthusiastically chase after balls, Frisbees, toys? Does she like to play tug?
Has she ever had the opportunity to chase a rabbit or a ground squirrel or other small critter?
Yes, and she barely looks their way.
Do you have a phrase with which you can get her excited?
When you're out on a walk and she's on a long line how does she act? Does she do that typical GSD zig-zag walk in front of you?
She either tries to gait, or she sniffs everything and pees on it. She doesn't seem to be curious about much of anything. Just wants to mark everywhere.
by Aqua on 16 August 2009 - 20:17
|Tending dogs work almost entirely in prey drive. They are motivated by the fervent hope that a sheep will step across the border which is the dog's permission to grip the sheep. They don't charge into the flock and chase the sheep - which would also get them a bite - because they've been trained no to. |
The herding instinct is evaluated by how and how much a green dog shows interest in a flock. Instinct tests are generally done with the sheep inside a fenced area and the dog is walked on a long line on the border along the outside the fence. You'll often see a green dog pounce at the flock, likely bark, to make the sheep move. When they do, the prey drive is further stimulated and the dog will run along the border (the fence) hoping to get more flock movement. The dog will keep his eyes on the sheep, show interest.
This is large flock tending, what Ulf and Geary do. The testing process is different with AKC style herding but the evaluation is basically the same: does the dog show interest or avoidance? Is there an inherent prey drive which can be stimulated?
Tending work may not be for Delphi.
by Pat Relton on 21 September 2009 - 21:15
|are his dogs good for schutzhund i wonder|
by dAWgESOME on 21 September 2009 - 21:49
YES!!!!!! to the original question. I just kind of skimmed though the rest of the posts so sorry if this is O/T. After looking at his website and watching some youtube videos I emailed him if he knew of anyone in my area doing HGH and unfortunately for me no.
by UlfKintzel on 06 November 2009 - 01:37
|And here I was famous two months ago and I almost missed it …. Here are the answers to some questions that were raised:|
Yes, I do take dogs into training that I board and train myself. I take one each year and it seems I am booked for 2010 and 2011. Feel free to inquire, though.
If you wish to train with me yourself you need to be within reasonable traveling distance in order to take regular lessons. I do currently have one opening.
As far as I know there are no other places than mine where the HGH training is offered on a flock more than 200 sheep big. HOWEVER, there are several places throughout the Northeast that do C-course. If you train on 50 or so sheep for course C and then take a few lessons with me it may get you the result of obtaining the title. There is now also an HGH club forming in NJ (it was mentioned a few times in these posts) that intends to have HGH trials starting in 2010.
No, prey drive and herding drive are not the same. They are related but are totally different. A herding dog is not driven by prey drive.
Rezkat is Kathy DiStaso, also on this forum. She trains currently with me. Her dog is Elexa vom Quasliner Moor.
Julie, I see you posted a video about the trial although we stated that taping is for private use only. How about giving the competitor credit: This is Kristin Siarkowicz with Lara vom Dolderbrunnen. She finished second with 81 points.
Yes, Ulf is excellent….oh, that wasn’t a question, that was a statement, never mind…..
White Clover Sheep Farm
683 Bagley Road
Rushville, NY 14544
PH & FAX: (585) 554-3313
by UlfKintzel on 06 November 2009 - 01:39
|PS: Yes, my dogs are good for SchH. Several of them obtained SchH 1,2,3 titles and breed surveys.|
White Clover Sheep Farm
683 Bagley Road
Rushville, NY 14544
PH & FAX: (585) 554-3313
by Xeph on 06 November 2009 - 03:45
|I don't remember how large his flock is, but I went to test with Geary Loff and he does HGH training and tends his flock with Beauceron.|