Is titling / breed surveying a GSD really useless? - Page 17

Relya: "To better the breed and to become a better trainer/breeder, you need to learn all you can, and the best way to learn is to actually work your dog(s)."
That´s what I tried to say, thank you so much!

Joanro, I am envious of your life.

Another example of what I call 'race memory', is the ability to train my mixed breed 'huskies' to work in harness as a team. I started all of them as puppies and four of the six I was able to  train and work as 'gee/ haw' leaders...I did not have a grown lead dog to train any of these puppies. No dogs have been used in the back ground of these dogs for as far back as probably 'ever'.

So if these cross bred huskies still can reach back into 'race memory' and work in harness, why do gsd owners/breeders find their breed unable to reach back into their genetics and do the same? I would argue that they can. 

ummmmm....yeah, it works for Herding...

How many generations did Huskys pull only sledges to imprint that "race memory"?

And, how many generations did we allow GSDs to do only a single type of work?

Still, all GSDs, due to their ancestor races, possess some instincts of border patrolling, which the Germans had effectively used in their style of sheep herding, which generally was protecting the crops from the sheep.

Or Hunting Dogs. Terriers have been around for ages, Fox Terrier may have started out in the 1900 but their anchestry of "going to earth" goes back waaaay back.

But the breeds were 'created' for their breed specific work.
Another thing to keep in mind, my haskies were crossed with wolf hybreds, some diluted three or four generations. The one in left wheel position was only two generations removed.
Plus, the sibes in this country ( southern, of lower 48)  have not been worked for dozens of generations, before the gsd was even created.

Berenf, there are very few gsd that are even needed to herd, especially here in the USA. So when would one find out they have herding ability with no training?
Can you imagine what would happen if a drivey, completely untrained or untested gsd was turned loose at a herding trial on a herd of sheep in an open field?
Now, take a 2 yr old gsd that is untrained with no foundation work, (same as my Fox terriers at the trial) and test him for nerves and bite work on a decoy completely unknown to the dog, and wearing equipment ( full bitesuit, wich the dog has never even seen such before) no prey moves by the decoy, only forward aggression, no training to familiarize the dog on back tie(entire scenario is new to said gsd)....BTW, this would be three generations no titles on top and two generations no titles on bottom. What are the most likely results if you did this with a gsd?

So you think for Herding they need to be tossed into a trial to test instinct?

Ever heard of Herding Instinct Test?

You can find out if a dog has herding instinct very easily, and at a very young puppy age.

In fact I can test a dozen puppies for herding instinct in less time than it takes to put on a bite suit.

dont you think they need to be titled in herding to see if they are any good