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by dani81176 on 07 June 2010 - 08:06
@therockkennels
a dog with good natural agression and good defense drive will respond (bark at strangers passing by) regardless of training. We're talking genetics at work, not (man) training.
a dog with good natural agression and good defense drive will respond (bark at strangers passing by) regardless of training. We're talking genetics at work, not (man) training.
by charlie319 on 07 June 2010 - 13:06
Agreed Dani... the breeding sets the behavior, but the training helps to shape and reinforce the response. In this thread, the OP doesn't provide much in the way of behavior assessment. For all we know, his dogs are not very good, or so confident they want the passerby to actually come into the property before reacting.
A good trainer, and a good decoy, can make a mediocre dog look good. Look for dogs that perform in different fields and with different decoys.
As far as defense drive, it is a little dicey as the dog may go into active defense, passive defense or just become conflicted on protection and when given the option of a- take on the threat or b- flee from the threat, they may opt for "C"- ignore the threat unless it is directed at him. That is why defense drive dogs should be trained not only by experienced trainers, but by those who are well in tune to the behavioral nuances of these dogs to anticipate and avoid the dog's breaking point.
Mind you, I prefer defense drive dogs over prey drive dogs because they always address the man and not just the toy/sleeve, and usually put a solid bite and hit on the decoy.
A good trainer, and a good decoy, can make a mediocre dog look good. Look for dogs that perform in different fields and with different decoys.
As far as defense drive, it is a little dicey as the dog may go into active defense, passive defense or just become conflicted on protection and when given the option of a- take on the threat or b- flee from the threat, they may opt for "C"- ignore the threat unless it is directed at him. That is why defense drive dogs should be trained not only by experienced trainers, but by those who are well in tune to the behavioral nuances of these dogs to anticipate and avoid the dog's breaking point.
Mind you, I prefer defense drive dogs over prey drive dogs because they always address the man and not just the toy/sleeve, and usually put a solid bite and hit on the decoy.
by dwchastain on 07 June 2010 - 17:06
MRK - Your comment "thank you all for the post. maybe what i have just need a big push in the right direction by professionals" is very encouraging. The only thing I would say different is "big push in the right direction to professionals".
The truth is that everyone contributing on this post can state an opinion but that is all you have are opinions, and not fully informed opinions at that. What I mean by that comment is that no one can accurately assess your dogs without seeing the behavior. Any trainer worth his/her weight will not render an opinion until they have observed your dogs and their reactions to different types of stimulation and/or situations. A good trainer whether it be Schutzhund, personal protection, or both can very quickly tell you if you have dogs that are ambivalent or confident, and if they can be trained to do what you require.
So I hope that you will end your frustration not be getting rid of your dogs as someone suggested, but by seeking the advice of a good trainer. At least then you will know what you have.
Good luck.
The truth is that everyone contributing on this post can state an opinion but that is all you have are opinions, and not fully informed opinions at that. What I mean by that comment is that no one can accurately assess your dogs without seeing the behavior. Any trainer worth his/her weight will not render an opinion until they have observed your dogs and their reactions to different types of stimulation and/or situations. A good trainer whether it be Schutzhund, personal protection, or both can very quickly tell you if you have dogs that are ambivalent or confident, and if they can be trained to do what you require.
So I hope that you will end your frustration not be getting rid of your dogs as someone suggested, but by seeking the advice of a good trainer. At least then you will know what you have.
Good luck.
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