Conformation Showing > Need Help: Should I consider showing this male? Conformation Critiques welcomed (16 replies)
Need Help: Should I consider showing this male? Conformation Critiques welcomed
by furryflurry on 25 April 2012 - 15:09
|I am seeking honest opinions on a 13 month old red black male that we wondered if he has show quality conformation. He's tall... he tapes at 26 inches with a level on his withers. Need honest assessments before investing time and money into training and potentially showing him. Thanks everyone who want to chime in!|
by Hundmutter on 25 April 2012 - 16:01
|It is only one photo; so it is hard to tell anything really about this young dog's suitability for the Show ring - I assume you mean Conformation showing ?|
The height: 26 in / 66 cm would normally be regarded as top size within the Standard, he can't really afford to grow any taller (having said that there are some awfully big dogs about !) Have you read your Breed Standard ? Does the breeder of your dog have any advice for you ?
The overall look of him - this is entirely my personal opinion, and I have no experience of the USA show scene - but he does not really excite me. He looks like a nice dog, but not with that extra presence that you need in a show-dog; but like I say, its only a/one photo.
At over one year, he is a little late to be starting out on a show career - certainly in the UK he would have already spent half his life being trained and shown. This may be a disadvantage; especially if you yourself are a novice.
Having said that, NO TIME SPENT TRAINING A GSD IS EVER A WASTE OF TIME ...
by SitasMom on 25 April 2012 - 16:40
go to a small conformation show and see that the judges comments and decide from there.
by BlackthornGSD on 25 April 2012 - 16:48
|The SV measures behind the withers--so he's probably within standard for height.|
by Ibrahim on 25 April 2012 - 19:10
I can help you with the critique, A first note about the stack is front legs should be placed a little backward and that would show a better shoulder angle and a better lay of shoulder blade. The far hock (from the viewr) should be placed a little forward, placing it this way shows his croup to be of correct angle while in fact it is a little steep.
My critique is based on current photo, A black/tan male of good type, correct proportions height to length and chest depth to total height, well balanced, large size, medium strength, good size of head, very good planes and ears, high withers of sufficient length, nice topline but back could be stronger and straighter, nice lay of croup but short (croup in correct stack is a little steep), correct tailset and good tail, very good hind angulation, good strong hocks, correct stifle angle, correct hind bones proportions, Nice chest front development, good length of front upper arm but slightly steep, shoulder blade is slightly forward placed, pasterns are weak/over angled. front feet are a little flat and toes are long, rear feet are better and tighter. His front is not very clean, he does not stand straight, some call it a little east/west.
by beetree on 25 April 2012 - 23:53
|Ibrahim, I am so impressed! .....Hey, have you ever re-measured Xaro (I think was his name?) Did he ever grow any more?|
by Ruger1 on 26 April 2012 - 02:29
|We just sent one of our horses for training. We were curious about how she would measure up in the show ring. Their first question was, " That will depend on the type of shows you plan on attending"..lol..I realized what a funny question that actually was..;)|
I think your male is very handsome. Ibrahim gave a very helpful critique..:) You should attend as a specator at some of the shows that you would like to attend with your male and see how he measures up to the competition..
by Ibrahim on 26 April 2012 - 05:00
Yes I did, he did not grow anymore in height but his head and bones did a little and his coat color became darker. As a matter of fact I sold him to a friend and he's just doing fine but was neutered. Thanks for asking
by Hundmutter on 26 April 2012 - 09:40
|Ok, flurry - now that you've got Ibrahim's proper 'critique' (as would be given by the judge if your dog was entered in a Show class), sit down with that and a copy of the Breed Standard, and compare. Then do what others have suggested, find yourself a dog show (or two ! ) you can spend time at, sit and watch the dogs (hopefully they will be GSDs but it doesn't matter too much from the point of view of getting used to showing), see if you can see what I meant by that 'something extra' and decide whether your dog has got that 'ring presence'; talk to exhibitors around the ring, get a proper idea of what is involved. |
When you have done all these things you will be best placed to decide for yourself whether it is a
good idea to put the work in to ring training and entering him in shows (and the travelling, and the money ...) at this late stage.
Whichever you decide to do in the end, I meant what I said - you can't lose in the long run by investing time in training your GSD to be steady and obedient and to allow people to touch him, look at his teeth, etc, even if he doesn't become a showdog he'll be happier and a better companion.
by Rik on 26 April 2012 - 13:45
|Nothing in the pic that suggests a waste of time showing. Actually a handsome boy. The waste of time (and money) comes from showing a dog not ring trained.|
Really, the only negative evident from the photo are the feet, as pointed out previous.
get him out and see what the judges say.
by furryflurry on 29 April 2012 - 12:11
|Thank you to all that commented. We found all of the suggestions very helpful and honest. Going to conformation classes as a viewer and video taping will be my M.O. for the summer. See ya at the canadian nationals this august.!|
by SitasMom on 30 April 2012 - 15:33
Conformation classes are a blast. Marcy in northwest houston has a "pick up" class every thursday night. its akc style, and with all types of dogs, but its really good learning for both dog and owner. understanding how to stack, letting someone else look at teeth, pat down and check testicles...having the dog or pup behave in an environment its not accustom to is all great stuff. its a different venue (AKC vs SV) and many of the lessons transfer. i take all of my dogs for a month of two of lessons when they're 4 or 5 months.
if you're intending to enter him, he needs to be fitted...there are a few topics that explain how do go about it on this site. use the search feature to find find out more.
in the photo, what i saw missing was intensity, he's standing nicley, but not very excited about anyting. a controlled intensity in the showring makes every dog look better. more treats and reward events could help this.
by sonora on 03 May 2012 - 06:03
Your 13 Mth. old,young dog is definitely show quality,
subject to him not having any disqualifying faults.
i. e . correct bite & number of teeth,correct temperamant and is complete.
Please ensure that if your dog has any dog aggression,
that you are able to curb or controll it,
for his aggression will surely affect his movement in the ring.
At the point of measurments of height being taken ,
ensure that you stand in front of your dog
and prevent him from being attracted to anything,
as this will increase his height at the withers.
Make sure he is competely relaxed.
When stacking your dog, please bend over the top,
use your left hand, lift the left upper arm of the dog,
moving it back,touching the side of the chest,
while ensuring the forehand is perpendicular to the ground
and the feet is pointed strait in front.
( Adjusting the dog by placing your hand below the chest
as in the picture will only unbalance him)
My Critique is :-
A large , medium strong , black & tan young dog
of very good proporation and very good type.
He has a good head and expression with a good length of neck
.high sloping withers , a firm , strong back and
a croup which is slighty short and steep.
The tail set could be better.
Still showing a good backline.
He has very good front and hind angulations,with good clean hocks.
He has a good depth of chest,a good forechest with a good underline.
From the front he shows good lenght of forelegs,
where the pasterns could be stronger. He stands with his left foot slighty out of alignment.
by sonora on 03 May 2012 - 06:05
He has many positives.but he should not get any taller.
The measuring of the dog's height is carried out by placing the measuring stick,
vertically against the back of the fore leg and pressing down lightly on
the horizontal bar against the top of the withers.( not behind the withers)
by windwalker18 on 13 May 2012 - 04:45
|Akc ring, you probably won't get a lot of rewards. The American "show line" (as in akc) are VERY extreem in the rear, and have great length in the loin. Liked and agree with the critique Ibrahim gave. If your expectations are winning Seiger at the USA show, again your expectations may be a touch high. But if you just like getting out there with the dog of your heart to see how he compares with others, and hang with other nutty Dog Folk absolutely go for it!! I showed in AKC for quite a few years, picked up a few points, even the major points on my Akita, but never finished a dog to their Championship. I still enjoyed being there, and showing my dogs. As I remind new folks about judging.... "Ya pays your Money, and ya takes your chances" |
I listen to the judges critique (especially someone respected in the breed) and also what others say about my dog, but don't always take it to heart. I prefer to know what my dog's faults are, and every dog has some. So, go... show...train... mostly have fun, and make it fun for your dog. He's very nice looking fellow, and certainly nothing to be shy about putting in a ring.
by CMills on 08 June 2012 - 02:36
|Nice looking overall dog. Tighten up his feet, that is my only comment.|
by SitasMom on 11 June 2012 - 03:59
Waiko, (Dog1) a GSL Sable is doing quite well in AKC conformation. It really depends on the judge. Some like the German dogs, others don't.
He would do better in SV style conformaiton, but you will have to get on the stick and get the Schutzhund training and a title before he's 2 or he will not be allowed to "V".
UKC is another venue, we've had sucess her with GSL's and also WL's. The judges like dogs that are physiclly fit and can carry themselves well. And represent the standard without overdoing it.
What ever you decied, enjoy your dog.