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Conformation Showing > Untitle Class at USA SS (17 replies)

by mfh27 on 10 January 2012 - 05:01

Posts: 420
Joined: Mon Aug 11, 2008 07:15 pm
I was looking at the new USA magazine's show results page for last years shows, and saw that dogs in the Adult class had show ratings.  What is the difference?

by VKGSDs on 10 January 2012 - 12:01

Posts: 1555
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 07:42 pm
Jim, you need a show rating to obtain a breed survey.  I've seen before where people intend to enter the open class for that rating, hence why I was throwing it out there for any lurkers.  The open class is for fun, for more ring practice, getting your dog more wins/awards, or putting a dog in front of specific judges.  There are lots of reasons to do it and it's always offered at club shows.  The Sieger Shows have been the exception.  The rating will not count towards a breed survey.  Lots of people aren't aware of this.

mfh, I'm in the same boat.  3 year old dog, earned SchH1 in November.  No shows within range before he hits 3.5.  He already has an SG from 13 months (show line dog).  There are so many stupid rules and "oh wait but...." things, why don't they just split the show classes by age or by title and leave it at that?

by workingdogz on 10 January 2012 - 13:01

Posts: 964
Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2011 10:42 pm
The devil is in the details for sure VK, these organizations keep making it harder and harder to enter!
The entry forms/requirements themselves force one to take a continuing education class 

Just wish we could go back to when it was all so simple.
Pay your money, show your scorebook/show card & membership,
and "run what you brung".

It's now almost to the point where someone could possibly
make a decent secondary income just filling out show forms for people

I personally think the untitled 24+mos class will help a lot of working line people,
and who knows, maybe it will also take some of the pressure off some wanting to
title/koer their own showlines and they won't feel the need to rush their dogs!
Might be a win-win?

All I know is, it will make it easier for me with my youngster when the time comes.
Less worry about "timing".

by VKGSDs on 10 January 2012 - 14:01

Posts: 1555
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 07:42 pm
No kidding.  I had an easier time entering the Canadian Sieger Show, and I am not Canadian, nor do I have CKC registered dogs nor am I a member of their national club.  All they wanted was my entry fee and a copy of my dogs' FCI recognized registration.

I don't quite understand how this class takes pressure off working line folks though?  You mean giving an opportunity to practice in the ring? 

What would take the pressure off all of us is just having clear cut rules, not rules like "if your dog is this age, then you are in this class, BUT if your dog becomes THIS age, THEN he is only elligible for this rating and needs this this and this to remain in that class..."

For me the most disappointing thing is how the SV conformation promotes the rush titling.  I was at a show one time, in the ring as the official photographer.  This show had two females in the untitled class, one female was REALLY nice.  I'm more of a working line person but I would have taken that bitch home.  The judge asked why she was in the untitled class when she should be campaigning in the working class.  Well she was still working on her titles (I believe the owner was doing it themselves).  The judge snickered at this and then went on a mini-rant about how such a nice dog needs to get her title done so she can be in the working class and get proper ratings.  He looked genuinely annoyed and even angry.  I was really disappointed at that because clearly the owners have a fabulous dog, it's not like they weren't showing her, but they were taking her time with the titles.  Oh this dog was only just three years old.  Basically the critique they got from this highly respected SV judge was that they should have just slapped the titles on the dog to bump her into the "working" class.  Then the show line folk insist they aren't rushing their dogs and that they are just that good getting all their titles by 2 years old. 

There is no incentive to actually focus on a solid foundation and good training.  No incentive whatsoever.  The only incentives are just getting those titles in the scorebook so the dog can be in the "working" class at 2 years old, and not only that but you are penalized at least one ranking if your dog isn't titled by 3.5 years old.

by workingdogz on 10 January 2012 - 14:01

Posts: 964
Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2011 10:42 pm
Sorry VK, My comment about taking some pressure off working line folks was in reference to the normal practice of focusing more on the work than showing is all. This will alleviate the 'need' to get out there and get that show rating before 24mos is all. And yes, I agree, it's a shame that most show lines are not given a chance to really develope to their full potential, instead they are rushed through without a chance to really 'shine', because by 2yrs they 'need' to be in the working class.

by VKGSDs on 10 January 2012 - 15:01

Posts: 1555
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 07:42 pm
Working or show, if the dogs want to breed survey they will still need to get their show rating before 24 months unless they plan to show in the working class without the breed survey first.

by trixx on 10 January 2012 - 15:01

Posts: 998
Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 02:20 am

yes, i think for myself its a good idea  to have this class as i sure need the experience and have an older female- 6 years old i titled with AKC titles so i never did any SCH titles with her, but i want to learn to be very good as my male is getting  SCH titled now , so want to get good when it is his time and personality i would rather show my male at the age or 4 or 5 when he is fully filled out, he sure will look alot better than when he was young,  he may not be ready for the USA SS , but i am going to get him ready of the WDA SS. he will be 4 years soon.


i have only show 3 dogs in small local SV shows.


i think alot  of people can benifit from showing in this class and i am sure they put this class in for extra money just like the long coat class.


this will be my first time showing at a national level, but i am doing it for the experience and i always go to a show for the fun of it all, so no big deal to me where my dog places.

by Rik on 11 January 2012 - 02:01

Posts: 2197
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 03:41 am
from a strictly business stand point for UScA, it is a good idea. If any of you think that finances must not be considered in putting on a show, then do one at your expense.

They are bringing SV judges from Germany, what do you think that cost. There are lots of people out there that have no intention of going the full route with sch/breed survey, SV requirements. Just want to attend/enjoy a big show and show what they have.

Why not give them a class.

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