Can a submissive female be titled? - Page 2

Question for Klossbruhe and Alphapup: I read your answers to this topic and they were very good and interesting. My question is this: I'm working a "shy" dog on prey with extreme ball drive. He'll play tug of war all day long and I let him win everytime, he goes off and beats the hell out of the tug. Now I'm at the point where I'd like to show him a sleeve but I don't have any "helpers" in my area. Can I introduce him to the sleeve myself????? Or is it a must that it must always be a "Stranger" or "Bad Guy"?

In answer to Flagbike's question about whether you can take the dog onto the sleeve by yourself, the answer is yes. This is a very old German method which many top trainers, such as Bernhard Flinks, still are using. Gradually you go from the big bitewurst to the puppy sleeve. Do not do this to early. The puppy's permanent teeth should certainly be in for 3 months and his mouth should be able to accommodate a pupply sleeve. After he wins the bitewurst one time, have the sleeve ready to go and get him to play tug of war with it instead of the bitewurst. It may take a little while for him to lose interest in the bitewurst but just be patient, eventually he will realize the new toy is the puppy sleeve. After he is very comfortable playing tug with the sleeve (usually 2 weeks or so) then you can put it on during a game of tug and gently shake him a bit and act like prey. Later, he can learn to chase you and get the sleeve (beginnings of the escape) and much later, say at 12-13 months he can be backtied to a tree and you can work him in beginning strike and grip work. But YOU MUST ALWAYS WORK YOUR OWN DOG IN PREY--NEVER IN DEFENSE. If you don't know what defense is, then you shouldn't work the dog. Many people are unaware that just facing a dog frontally rather than sideways can be defense and put stress on some dogs. You must not work your dog in defense because you will destroy your bond. Only a helper can do that. And I would not advise this with a shy dog. Just train him or her in prey right through your SchH 1 or IPO 1. Remember you can introduce him to the sleeve, but YOU CAN'T BE THE BAD GUY OR THE STRANGEER. You can be Mr. Fun & Games, or a big squirrel he would like to catch. Nothing more.

Hi DawnMarie, [[By the way , she is from conformation lines...go figure,right?]] "What does that mean?" What it means is that ,in talking with a number of people involved with the breed, the general consensus seems to be that "showline"dogs do not have the same degree od working ability/hardness as the "workingline"dogs appear to. Whether or noy this is true , I don't know. This is just what I have heard.The comment was made because this particular female seems to fall into the category of what I have heard many people say is "common" in showline dogs...lack of hardness/character/working ability. Again, let me reiterate,lest I get jumped on by other members of this board: THIS IS ONLY WHAT I HAVE HEARD...but I have heard it from too many people!!! Having said that , let me also say that this female is just ONE INDIVIDUAL and I am sure that there are many fine woking conformation line dogs out there) dogs like Atlas von Bad-Boll,Cello von der Romerau,Ajax vom Haller Osning come immediately to mind) just as there are working line dogs that are not Bundesseiger Prufung material. Now for you DawnMarie: "Good luck with your responsible decision..." What does THAT mean? Making a responsible decision regarding ANYTHING is hardly a matter of luck. All the same ,your feedback is appreciated as is the feedback of All OTHERS who were nice enough to respond! Regards

dshlerner, got it... i have friends in both working and show and its funny because we all respect each others choices in lines, and none of my working line friends have ever noticed a difference in the showlines protection work... maybe because they all train with awesome trainers???? i only hear on here, or other BB, the working/showline debate thing. maybe i am fortunate that the showlines i have come in contact are hard working showlines lol i always see the good in BOTH and get passed the bad in both because there are bad and good in both. will always see me walk a neutral line, dont judge others til you walk a mile in their moccassins kinda thing lol my father used to say that all the time. as for what i said, in regards to your responsible choice, meaning you seem like you will make a responsible decision, if you feel your gsd has the temperament that you would want in the progeny to carry on etc... then you will know what is right. good luck may have been a quick response... it was a kind regard, nothing negative :) regards, Dawnmarie

Jeez, I wouldn't even want to own a shy dog let alone waste my time trying to coddle it to a title!

Buddyspal, Thanks for that profound reply.It's people like you that make this board so worthwhile! DawnMarie, Thanks for the clarification.Much appreciated!

Thanks so much. It's nice to be appreciated.

Buddyspal, ...whatever...:)